PATRON TAKES - DS9 S2E5

"Truth is in the eye of the beholder, Doctor. I never tell the truth because I don't believe there is such a thing. That is why I prefer the simple straight line simplicity of cutting cloth." - Garak

The ending of this episode was an odd one for me - the episode seemed more concerned about screwing over Dukat than resolving things for Rugal. We don't even see his Bajoran parents after the ruling is made - he gets more contact with O'Brien!

The Cardassians are some of the best villains (?) Trek developed, and they hired actors who can really play them well.

Look out! Racist O'Brien is back!

DS9 is the series with the best recurring characters, by far. Partly because they're so good, but also you don't have to jump through hoops to explain their appearances. They're always around.

Garak and Gul Dukat are great. I think at this point in the series, they were two of my favorite characters.

One small thing that bothers me is how the Cardassian occupation is accidentally downplayed by failure to scale the numbers up properly. When O'Brien and Rugal have their moment, Rugal mentioned that the Cardassians murdered "over 10 million". That number is supposed to be shocking but if you think about it, it kind of falls flat. You have to remember that the Cardies were in control over the entire planet of Bajor (arguably the entire system, given that there are habitable moons) and that the occupation lastet 50 YEARS! That puts the average annual death toll at 200.000 - 220.000 (considering "over 10 million" means somewhere between 10-11 million). For reference, in 2019 approx. 385.000 people died of homocide (this figure does not include victims of war and terrorism). That makes present day Earth more dangerous than Bajor under Cardassian rule, statistically speaking.

Would this work as an TNG/TOS episode? yes. But it fits perfectly with DS9.

Ongoing intrigue, and a developing secondary cast. Great episode to build background and lore. A.

Just plain, simple Garak.

I'm very happy with how the writers (and actors) step up their game with Bashir and Garak. Also there are some very nice, minor Sisko moments that I think back on a lot. I've always felt miffed at how the particular plotline "resolved" itself at the end of this episode. Perhaps it's a theme of this installment that most problems of war can't easily be fixed. At least we learn the original name of DS9: "Terok Nor."

Here’s the main question that I want to know. Would you guys eat the cardassian stew?

Holy shit, there’s playing the long game and then there’s playing the Dukat game! This is a sad as hell episode, but it opens up so many characters so much more !

I'm with Miles on this, you just can't trust those damn Cardies!

This episode makes me say, More gul Dukat More Garrack

I really enjoy this episode a lot! The biggest Garak showcase we've had in the series since probably the beginning of season 1 and the episode is all the better for it. It's also one of the best early examples of the show utilizing it's unique position in the star trek universe as a stationary setting. The worlds of Bajor, DS9, and Cardassia become richer and deeper as the show adds to its lore.

And now after Kira first asked Sisko in The Homecoming, we get ANOTHER "Dad can I borrow the car" scene with Bashir asking for a Runabout in the middle of the night lol

Another episode featuring Garak! What do you think of his use and portrayal in DS9 so far? Any Theories? Comments? Questions?

A nice episode looking at the issues of displaced children after a conflict, such as Vietnam. Garak is excellent, and we're seeing more of the moral ambiguity of the situation that is Cardassia and Bajor. Have you noticed that DS9 has been quietly building up a secondary cast of characters, recurring people you see every few episodes, who can be used for the continuity and a feel for the place? Especially compared to TNG, where after 7 seasons, those secondary characters are a "hey look, it's X" where as DS9 it's "oh, this person is in the episode"

Okay, they've done this before in Next Generation with “Suddenly Human" where a boy is raised in a culture alien to his genetics. This one is better.

Dukat declares himself the representative of children everywhere, and Sisko thinks this is good enough to let the guy sit in on a custody hearing?

Dukat does a great job of balancing his transparent villainy with the limitations of diplomacy. If he weren’t involved to tip the scales, who do you think the child should have been granted to?

This episode teaches us that even if a teenager sitting in the food court looks appealing, you can’t just go up and grab them. #FrownedUpon

DS9 heard you were tired of Bajoran politics and decided to give you some Cardassian politics instead!

Another episode with no clear heroes, no easy choices, and a truly plain and simple tailor. Andrew Robinson is a genius actor, in my opinion all of the guest stars here knock it out of the park.

GARAK! I like how at first, this is just a puzzle to be solved, maybe a game to be played, until the child asks him if he’s there to bring them home, and he’s forced to tell her no. It’s a nice moment, showing that there is more to Garak.

One thing that bothers me about this episode is when Keiko makes the Cardassian meal, she says she thought Rugal would enjoy food from his own people. He was raised by Bajorans and has no memory of his Cardassian heritage. As far as he's concerned, he is culturally Bajoran. Do you guys have as strong of feelings about O'Brien's racism against Cardassians here as you do about Kirk's racism against Klingons in The Undiscovered County?

A pretty good episode which has a follow-up book which is probably the best Star Trek novel I've ever read.

Just once I’d like to see the O’Briens have an argument where the Chief yells, “Shut your Keiko!”

Question: Is Bashir more interesting when not confined to medical related tasks? What more do you want to see from our young doctor?

Finally, Dukat in the flesh! Were you getting tired of his video call appearances only?

Dukat is the galaxy’s biggest hater.

A kid, a little problem where someone needs to learn a lesson, and some nauseating wisdom inevitably to come. Is it the Brady Bunch? No it's typical TNG writing infecting a show that had been doing so well. A pity . I had to turn this off after about 10 or 15 minutes.

Garak returns! And finally Dukat is let loose from the confines of a viewscreen where he's been stuck in every appearance since Emissary.

The return of Garak really indicates that the show is starting to get going. There is still a lot of "meh" before it really his its stride, but this is an important milestone for the series.

A real missed opportunity to not have Rugal interact with Jake and Nog. Maybe those on-the-nose lines like “you’re a Cardassian,” would have been better coming from Nog and not make the Chief and Keiko be so obtuse here. I don’t disagree with the outcome but there’s a level of cowardice from the writers that they didn’t say why Sisko made the decision he did. Was it a political decision, did he judge the Bajoran parents for any self hate that Rugal feels? But the episode wasn’t really interested in discussing the themes of identity it introduced here as much as just making a point that Sisko is not Picard.

Excellent episode, but I disagree so strongly with Sisko's decision at the end that it falls from A/S territory to just a B.

IMO what DS9 does best - present the difficult choices, with empathy/understanding for all sides, reflecting how individuals are caught in the middle and harmed - and how Sisko struggles to find the right direction - love to watch him portray his pain, while still moving forward

Garak! Always a good episode when he is featured.

Really liked this one, not only do we have to grapple with which family do we send this kid to, but alot of other orphans, along with the Chiefs biases, AND the Cardassians political interference. A solid B+

I’m about to say something that some DS9 fans will consider sacrilege…but for me, the real strength of this series has always been in its secondary cast of characters! I put Garak, Nog and several characters in seasons to come right up there with the likes of Odo and Quark…and far more interesting than the rest of the main cast! I’m looking forward to the guys meeting them soon! 🖖

Slow and boring wins the race. Easy S Tier.

Ah… plain and simple Garek makes his return. I absolutely love the adversarial components of his and Dukat’s relationship. What are you guys looking forward to seeing from these characters???

Sisko's decision is the correct one. Rugal has been raised to be ashamed of his own identity as a Cardassian. You can't just adopt the culture of another species, while denying your own biological race. It's a deep conflict and trauma that Rugal should not have experienced, regardless of being physically taken care of by his adoptive Bajoran family.

I can't blame Rugal for biting the hand of anyone who creepily approaches, touches him without warning and comments that Rugal is very good looking. This is a multiple klaxon/flashing emergency light situation. I prefer version 1.12 of Garek. It makes no sense for such a secretive man to be so overt in his behaviour and mannerisms. The subtle Garek is a BIG improvement.

Great to see Garak again after ~20 episodes. I think the dynamic with him improves Bashir's character. I also like O'Brian being confronted with his racism here, and Keiko being very firm in hier stance about it (the selection of the meal was misguided though). Overall I like the episode, but I wish they would have taken more time to explain Sisko's decision in the end. Yes, the adoption is the result of a previous kidnapping, but the Bajoran family is all Rugal nows, and it's were he wants to be. On the other hand: even if Rugal's adoptive parents love him, it's still a kind of abuse to have Rugal's race constantly be described as some kind of monster. Imagine that happening in our own reality... all in all, the final decision needed a bit more focus.

It just doesn't seem right. Why can't we all just have whatever we want from the Replicator?

The O'Briens and Sisko. So good with kids. Keiko trolls Rugal with Cardassian food. And Miles tells the kid his opinion matters, and that he should talk to Sisko about where he wants to go... Sisko, you know, the guy who in the end just rips him away from his loving adoptive parents and sends him to Cardassia, the place he hates. Great job, great job.

Wow, Garak’s second-ever appearance! I’d ask if you guys were surprised by his return… but Patron takes & YouTube comments about the character have ruined that for everyone.

i was REALLY suprised that they send rugal back with this bio dad at the end. but then, im not sure where the best place for rugal would be. his adoptive dad, without meaning to, has emotionally abused him. but his bio dad is a complete stranger to him! this poor kid would need serious help and counselling.

Gotta feel for Rugal he be a outsider no matter where he ended up, son of a oppressor on Bajor, and impure cardassian on Cardassia

The scene where Keiko says to O’Brien, “That was a very ugly thing you just said” has always struck me as very well done. It isn’t overblown from either of them; just Keiko drawing a firm line and O’Brien floundering a bit. It’s realistic that he’s not quite able to reassess what he said in that moment, but I think you can see the impact moving forward.

Garak deserved to get bitten. Hands off!

Hey, Garak is back!

Great episode, Garak, Dukat, probably Bashir’s best episode yet. I love the parallel with The Wounded, the O’Brians at the dinner table with a Cardassian issue up for discussion. The only thing that bugs me with this one is the kid. Just hate his performance and he comes across badly for me. Whiny. Garak saves it. Good B.

While I always enjoyed the main cast of TNG more than the DS9 main cast, I always thought the "secondary" cast of DS9 really stood out. Garek, Dukat, Nog, Kaiko etc, really adds a second level to the show that TNG didn't have.

AKA "Suddenly Cardassian" not sure how I feel about the ending, but here we see DS9 continue to dig info the fallout from it's premise. Plus, more Garak is always fun and I'm TOTALLY sure you had no idea he was coming back.

I enjoy the political intrigue in this episode, and both Marc Alaimo and Andrew Robinson are excellent, as always. But the ending really leaves a bad taste in my mouth - just tearing the boy away from the only family he knows and sending him to live with his biological father feels like entirely the wrong decision to me, especially the way it's done almost as an afterthought.

Love this one it’s a great return for Garak and Bashir’s best episode so far. It also helps flesh out the Cardassians and Bajorans. Easy B.

Keiko "Poor Rugal. He grew up hating his own people and everything about them. I know! I'll make him some Cardassian food." O'Brien "Maybe we should just do pizza tonight."

In TNG’s Suddenly Human, the boy stripped from his parents was not returned, but in this episode he was. Even though the situation isn’t exactly the same, which do you feel is a more satisfying conclusion?

Guys, I'm starting to think that maybe this Garak guy isn't so plain and simple after all.

An episode of the week. More info about the occupation. It’s ok. Some good O’brian family stuff. I think you’ll call this contract filler.

Do you guys feel this wealth of mysterious history behind Garak? He's up there with Kira and Nog for me. And he plays amazingly off Bashir. Early season work showed that Dax and Bashir never really sparked, but Garak and Bashir, as actors, play off each other beautifully.

Garak the GOAT returns