PATRON TAKES - DS9 S1E13

The ideas in this episode were intriguing. But the actual episode was basic Trek. Interesting to see how non-Ro Kira is. Kira is bonded to her faith despite her trauma. Ro rejected it in part due to trauma. Both are wounded.

No half measures

Kira Nerys has a lot of trauma from her past with the Resistance to deal with. Nana Visitor with another fantastic performance.

This episode could’ve been better, but it’s still good setting up the religious strengths of the people of Bajor

I'm curious, have you guys noticed the common thread with the names of the runabouts? Camille Saviola who plays Kai Opaka never ceases to amaze me. Her presence, even from the start of this season in Emissary is so strong. And Nana/Kira is excellent in this episode, mourning for the Kai and finding honesty within herself about the violence of her past. I always tear up on those scenes. Kudos to the writers on this one, tackling some of the effects of long term violence on a person.

Huh guess I'm in the minority here...I LOVE this episode. Such a cool sci-fi premise. Each character that was focused in this episode gets their moment and are needed. What really made me love this on rewatch was seeing Kira confess to Opaka, and how Opaka helped her "I've known nothing but violence since I was a child" "In the eyes of the Prophets you are all children. Bajor has much to learn from peace" "I'm afraid the prophets won't forgive me" "They're just waiting for you to forgive yourself." FUCK! Such a good scene and makes me feel the loss of Opaka even more.

I wish we had gotten to see more of Kai Opaka before this, it would have felt more impactful. As it stands, I still like this episode, even though it doesn't really earn the emotions it wants us to feel, and the prisoners aren't as fleshed out as they should be. But Nana Visitor alone carries this one to a 7/10 (B).

I was sad to see Opaka “die.” I liked her in the pilot and wanted to see her more.

Imagine if instead of dying because he was old and had pneumonia the pope died because he got blown up by video game cosplayers and then turned into a zombie. Yet the episode is actually good. That's DS9 for you.

This episode shows an important difference between Kira & Ensign Ro. Ro was skeptical of her religion while Kira is a devout true believer.

The thing that really stands out to me in this episode is Nana Visitor (Kira) starting to show her acting chops. Other than that, major plot repercussions to come.

This is indeed DS9 starting to show its colors - killing the (sort of) pope and then making the resurrection nowhere near a victory for the good guys. Carmen Saviola had such an amazing screen presence as Opaka, definitely one of my favorite characters in the series.

This is a decent episode, although I feel like the basic premise could have easily been done on TNG. Maybe if we had been able to get to know the Kai better, it would have had a bigger impact. I would give it a C.

I don’t know why when Opaka asked O’Brien about his daughter it made me want to cry? Must have been cause MAYBE somewhere hidden in my brain, I knew what was coming in the rest of the episode, but more strongly from the acting by Camille Saviola. Good dramatic acting that gives to YOU feeling emotions !

I always thought this was a very weak way to use Kai Opaka. The episode would have had a lot more weight if she died for real, and even then that's a pretty anticlimactic way to kill off a character like the Kai.

The people on this planet remind me of Ukraine and Russia.

This I think I described it as a solid meat and potatoes ST episode. Crew goes to planet, crew finds a problem with life and death stakes, crew gets involved, crew goes home. You can insert any crew, change the people fighting, and do this story on any show. It's not great but it's not bad either. A perfectly acceptable way to spend an hour.

Put your phaser away, Walter.

I love this episode. I enjoy how it addresses hatred. These people in Pain, suffering, no hope of release or conclusion. They are offered a chance, and still see it as nothing more than an opportunity to hurt others, rather than save themselves. The sad truth is, is extremely realistic to what has happened countless times, and will sadly happen countless more. Vengeance and hatred are powerful, and this delivers a powerful message about them in my opinion.

what would you do if you were forced to stay on a planet like this?

Camille Saviola does an excellent job as the Kai. Nana Visitor adds some more depth to her character - Major Kira - and her grief at the apparent death of Kai Opaka is a high point. However, I do find the story a bit weak - one of those that could've been an episode in any Trek show. In other hands it could've been a mediocre C-grade, but it is lifted to a solid B IMO.

A strange but also a brilliant episode if you know about Buddhist concepts like reincarnation and samsara (being stuck in the death/rebirth cycle), and Bodhisattvas ("bow-dee-SOUGHT-vuh" a type of Buddha who stays to help others escape samsara and attain nirvana). Is Opaka a sort of Bodhisattva here for them then?

Not a great episode. The Pope of their entire planet is stuck on war world, it should have felt bigger.

Only Opaka keeps the bajoran fraction in line... Get rid of her with an awesome storyline over the season? Meh... a random planet in the gamma quadrant will do!

I am sure that losing the equivalent of Bajor's Pope in a trip through the wormhole will have no political reprecussions in the series, right? Good premise, good episode even if the ending is a bit predictable, but yeah...seeds for future stories.

Sometimes changing one thing in a story makes it 1000% better... The aliens on the planet should have been Bajorans, who accidentally went through the wormhole 200 years ago and crashed on that planet, unable to die. Take away the idea that they were just evil people. What would normal people do if they were trapped together, limited resources, and unable to die?

An intriguing premise in my view, an endless war waged purely out of the momentum of their past, and weird technology. The episode itself is fine in execution, but Kira’s breakdown is the soul of it. That moment alone lifts it above average. Great character development and as always, makes me wonder how deep my mental scars would be if I lived as a "freedom fighter" in occupied territory, for years or even decades.

Very weird episode… the walking undead.

8/10 if u dont think about it too much. Great emotional scenes from Kira and Opaka.

Question: do you think the absence of Kai Opaka will have consequences for the future in the show?

How the hell is Sisko supposed to explain to his superiors what happened here? Getting the Kai killed two minutes into a sightseeing trip is something your career would not survive. It is the most disastrous thing that could happen in his mission of uniting Bajor and making them Federation ready. ...I think the bigger problem is that I don't care about any of the characters on either side of this conflict, and I only sort of care about Kai Opaka. Perhaps if they had waited a few seasons to do this one there would be tension over whether or not the crew could work a miracle so the beloved recurring character would survive. A mixed bag for sure

I like this one better than Vortex, especially for the Kira development and for giving Siddig more to work with than "Ray-oooooo Vantika". I don't think the commentary on immortality is very relevant given the groups involved hate each other fanatically. It's pretty mid to me. B-

I didn't notice until I'd rewatched the episode a couple of times, but at the moment when Opaka touches Kira's pah, the music that begins playing sounds a little familiar: https://youtu.be/TET7uUL0NFU

Nana Visitor's acting when Kira mourns over Opaka's body always worked for me and felt raw and powerful. But I could also imagine others seeing it as too big or as over acting. Where do you guys land on that moment?

These days I am too distracted by the fact that one of the aliens is Mike from Breaking Bad. He just stands out so much to me.

One would imagine decapitation or burning them to ash would finish them off.

How Come they don't just use the Federation Phasers and simply vaporise the other side? Can't heal if you're vapor.....

War. War never changes... Again, not a bad episode, but not particularily notable, except it seemingly "kills off" a side character we only really knew from the pilot. And yet, for all we've had of Opaka till this point, I have liked her and her perfornance. She's basically what you'd want from a religious leader like this, very motherly, down to earth, yet having an ethereal wisdom to her.

We're fightin' a war here Waltuh

The biker gangs from "The Vengeance Factor" return! A very TNG-Season-2 episode. And a criminally unimaginative use of the Kai, one of the most intriguing characters from the pilot.

It's a good idea for a story but it feels undercooked. Explore Opakas motivation and characterise her more. Plus while I really like Nana Visitor as Kira I feel like she really overacts here.

Fascinating episode and another DS9 that doesn’t have an easy answer. Remember being shocked that Opaka was left behind at the end

A somewhat salient episode that plays as both an allegory for the curse of eternity, and also as a through line to more backstory on Kira and how she experienced the atrocities of the occupation. Opaka's departure feels like an afterthought because we only really see her in the premier -- do you want to know more about the Bajoran religion or do you feel it's superfluous in a sci-fi story to delve so much in to just one culture.

The senerio that these guys went through was like a video game from hell.

The idea of two immortal armies fighting an eternal, unwinnable war as some kind of punishment, is metal af. And the Kai staying behind to try and help them heal, bring peace and forgiveness, is touching and inspirational. Special props to Nana Visitor, feel like she really got to show her acting chops in this one. Strong A.

Not sure if I'm in the minority here or not, but I never really loved this one. I'm not entirely sure why; it's a good premise and I don't find any huge faults with the execution. But it feels to me like an episode that would have worked better on TNG.

The main guy that Sisko and company align with was played by a much younger Jonathan Banks, who'd go on to play Mike in Breaking Bad

Love the moral dilemmas raised in this episode. A world created to force criminals to suffer forever, even keeping them from dying. It’s fun seeing Jonathan Banks in his pre-Breaking Bad days. Love the scenes between Opaka and Kira as the latter gets some sort of healing from all she has endured. Solid episode.

This is the curse of immortality, to care so little about your life and yet never find peace. S tier.