[FIXED] Weird win 10 boot hang issue
FIXED! read the fix at bottom of post!
I will leave this post with it's original content, cuz MOTTO of this post is "EVERYTHING can be fixed!" .. every now and then i've asked some "experts" what they think and they're all like "just re-install" cuz their tiny "expert" 80 IQ brain crashed and they started blaming TrueCrypt and other "hacker" programs..
only question is "are YOU the person to fix it? or are you a QUITTER?"
I posted about it on Win 10 forums long ago, all those "experts" had no idea how to fix it, bunch of RETARDS with 80 IQ, they only know how to go offtopic and blame, but no idea how to actually debug or fix things. the FACT that even Claude AI couldn't figure it out without debugger, is PROOF that nobody in world has documented this issue in public or AI would have found it.
It's safe to say that I'm the FIRST one to document this bug!
For years i've had this weird boot hang issue that is bugging me and i can't seem to fix it, i highly doubt it, but MAYBE someone has any ideas?
I doubt it, cuz i have discussed this with 4 different AIs and they're all clueless (gemini, copilot, chatgpt and claude). anyways here's a summary of what/where/how/why.
THE ISSUE
Win 10 Pro Build 19041.vb_release.191206-1406 is hanging 3 mins at boot right where BIOS hands off to Windows drivers (the moment keyboard/mouse LEDs flicker off for 1-2 secs on normal system).
During that time, i see windows logo and the circling dots.
NO drive activity, NO hardware usage of any kind, this is STRONG indication that it's waiting on something that doesn't exist and then times out.
It's where PC first boots using BIOS drivers and then it switches to windows (it's the very first time windows logo appears), it's where windows starts loading all the USB drivers..etc, which is why on normal system, you see your LEDs (if you have any on keyboard, mouse...etc) will turn off for short period of time, maybe a second or two. headsets are usually not affected as they only draw power from USB to light up LEDs, while keyboards/mice use drivers so it disables them for a split second to swap from BIOS to windows drivers.
In my case they remain off for entire duration of boot hang, indicating something is failing BEFORE windows even loads any drivers, which makes it near impossible logging the error.
I have monitored HDD/SSD LEDs and there's NO activity, so it is NOT trying to read/write anything. Even a tiny amount of activity would blink the LED at least once, none of that happens.
The hang is always the same duration per PC:
Main PC (256gb Verbatim SSD): 3 min hang
VMware (either using physical cloned drive via USB or cloned .img): 3 min hang on both.
Secondary old PC (250gb Samsung 850 EVO): ~10 min hang (not sure why it has longer hang, but probably some other hardware issue as it also has some other BIOS boot issue, just tested for the sake of it).
After the hang, all HDD LEDs start blinking and boot continues normally.
No BSOD, no errors, everything works fine once booted.
Also this hang doesn't happen when i put PC to sleep or hibernate, it only happens on fresh boot.
SYSTEM HISTORY
Win 10 Pro Build 19041.vb_release.191206-1406
TrueCrypt encrypted OS partition/drive (first partition, then entire drive).
Windows originally installed on 250gb HDD
Later cloned to 250gb Samsung SSD
then cloned 250gb to 256gb using hardware docking station cloner
Decrypted, updated Windows, re-encrypted with TrueCrypt
Drive has been used across multiple motherboards over the years:
Asus Crosshair V Formula Z (AM3+, FX8350)
Asus Z170 Gaming Pro/X (LGA1151, i7-6700K)
Current: B760 Gaming Plus WiFi DDR4 (i5-14600KF)
Secondary old PC: ASRock board, Phenom II CPU, DDR3, GTX 550 Ti / GTX 680 / GTX 980 all tested (boot hang is 10 mins with same SSD, but its probably cuz of how older hardware handles the timeout)
TrueCrypt 7.1 used for OS partition encryption (legacy boot required)
Later i decrypted OS partition and encrypted entire drive so i can use windows updates and recovery (in theory, untested as of now, will use as last resort to see if update would work / fix).
Windows has telemetry, updates, UAC, SysMain, Defender and various services disabled
MSI Afterburner (RTCore64.sys) and old ShadowPlay installed, but removed for testing purposes - no change.
Comodo Cleaning Essentials (portable) leaves kernel drivers behind (removed using comodo cleaning tools + microsoft program installer/uninstaller tool (not included in windows, must download from aka.ms). it's a special tool that clears registry and other entries when there's a bad install that left remnants behind, for example it fixed issues with "windows kits" not installing as it had some remnants.
used O&OShutUp10++, but it was after boot hang was already happening, highly doubt that's the issue.
KEY CLUES
Same Windows image = same hang on EVERY PC it's put into (not hardware specific)
connected SSD via USB docking and booted it via vmware = still hangs 3 mins on the dot.
cloned entire SSD using OSForensics as .img (onto HDD), made .vmdk file and loaded that .img in vmware, still 3 min hang.
Different hang durations on older PC/hardware (about 10 min).
SAFE MODE also hangs for the same duration = eliminates all third party drivers
After hang ends, all HDD LEDs start blinking = storage enumeration completing
chkdsk found 4kb bad sectors on ALL drives including clones (originally 250gb, cloned to every subsequent drive) - if it was corrupt windows core file, then scannow and/or restore health would have fixed it, yes?
ntbtlog shows dxgkrnl.sys BOOTLOG_NOT_LOADED on every boot (think i fixed it with DDU, but no effect)
WHAT'S BEEN RULED OUT / TESTED
Same Windows image = same hang on every PC, including VMware.
Safe mode also hangs for the same duration — rules out all third party drivers
Ran DDU in safe mode (full nvidia removal) — no change
Ran DISM /RestoreHealth and SFC /scannow — no change, no errors found
Fully decrypted and uninstalled TrueCrypt, tested without it — no change
Event viewer is USELESS since it starts logging AFTER the hang (checked it many times).
Disabled boot-start drivers: AsIO, inspect, cmdGuard, dam, EPMVolFl — no change
Disabled enterprise/server storage drivers (LSI, MegaRAID, 3ware etc) — no change
Disabled pciide, intelide, amdsata, iaStorV and other legacy storage drivers — no change
Switched SATA mode IDE to AHCI on secondary PC — no change, caused BSOD, reverted
Enabled ReadyBoot autologger — no change
Ran chkdsk /f /r — found and relocated 4kb bad sectors — no change (however that 4kb bad sectors carries over with cloning, which is interesting, even brand new SSD says 4kb bad sectors after i clone onto it)
Booted the SSD via USB docking in VMware — still hangs same duration
Cloned SSD using OSForensics into .img and ran it in VMware - still same hang
Procmon boot logging — records nothing during the hang, only starts after hang ends, confirms hang happens before Procmon's kernel driver even initializes
WPR boot trace — access denied even as SYSTEM, ADK install failed/incomplete (but i think it won't help either as WPR would start AFTER the hang)
ntbtlog shows dxgkrnl.sys failing to load every boot but fixing it had no effect
HWiNFO, Comodo CCE, DiskInternals Linux Reader, HTC Vive, Tobii EyeX remnants all uninstalled — no change
The hang happens before any disk activity — pure in-memory/CPU phase
The hang happens in VMware with fully virtual hardware — rules out physical hardware enumeration
Disabled the following upper/lower filter drivers:
EUDCPEPM (EaseUS)
EPMVolFl (EaseUS)
PxHlpa64 (Roxio/Sonic)
SpatialGraphFilter (Mixed Reality)
I first deleted registry keys and rebooted, hang was still there. Then i deleted the physical driver files from system32/driver and then it BSODed on next boot with INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE
copilot's explanation is that there must have been something cached and it still tries to load them even tho they don't exist, but it's IRRELEVANT as boot hang is STILL THERE, the BSOD happens AFTER the boot hang, so i think it's safe to say they're ruled out aswell.
DRIVERS FAILING EVERY BOOT (Event ID 7026)
AsIO (orphaned ASUS/ASRock driver)
dam (Windows Data Access Manager - cause unknown)
All disabled via registry, no effect on hang.
Personal note: it has to be one of the very early drivers that loads BEFORE any installed programs, since hang starts before any 3rd party program is able to even load, hang happens in very early stage where it loads basic drivers for keyboard, storage controllers ..etc, which is why procmon's boot logging didn't work either, it only started logging AFTER the hang was over, which is where windows loads 3rd party kernel drivers and which is where procmon started to log.
.. when i have a PC issue, then it's always something that nobody else has ever heard of. The very FACT that even claude is clueless, is proof of this :( but MAYBE someone has some ideas, altho i very highly doubt it. I just wanted to post it out here just for the sake of it.
NO i will NOT reinstall as i have put YEARS of effort and time into customizing my windows. there's insane amount of customization gone into it. deleting and reinstalling is NOT a solution, it's like saying that if your car makes weird noise then buy a new car, that is what dumb people do! i want to find the REAL CAUSE and FIX IT!
So far my own theory is that it's either:
1) piece of hardware that windows is waiting on and then times out
OR
2) some core system service/driver that windows is waiting on and then times out.
What me and all AIs have agreed on: is that it's some kind of a TIME OUT. windows is trying to do something > can't > keeps trying (hang) > times out > boot continues.
It STILL bugs me why old PC has about 10 min hang, in fact one of my other boards (forgot which one) also had 10 min hang, perhaps it's NOT even windows? perhaps it's some bootloader and older hardware handles timeouts differently? It has longer hang on older hardware, but 3 min hang on modern hardware + VMware, BUT why does it show windows logo then? Ugh..
UPDATE:
i got WPR working and as i suspected, it didn't record the hang. which means that hang is in VERY EARLY stage, even before the WPR can start recording. but then again i already knew that from the way it hangs (when it switches from BIOS to win drivers, which is one of the very first things that windows does before loading anything else, since it needs basic drivers to move forward).
UPDATE #2:
this is getting on my nerves.. ALL AIs are clueless.. so i'm taking a different approach, instead of trying to fix it, i installed another win 10 on vmware and trying to replicate it, so far i've done:
installing truecrypt + encrypting system partition
installed windows 10 firewall control (3rd party by sphinx)
disabled ALL the same services (win updates, medic service ..etc (AI gave me exact powershell cmd to disable them all in bulk, checked to make sure they're disabled.
all this, no hang on fresh system.. so whatever it is, it's something simple, yet complex. it must be some small thing i keep missing.
UPDATE #3:
ugh.. i wanted to try windbg, but on some reason it won't install, it gives "unknown hard error", i pinned it down to GAYvidia telemetry service (that i thought i disabled ages ago) locking some .dll file.. BUT even after that, it still won't run.
while it runs on vmware when using this EXACT clone drive.. i cloned the ssd into .img and ran it in vm, debugger works.. and it made sense cuz vm doesn't run any nvidia packages as it doesn't have nvidia GPU.
while trying to fix it.. i manged to screw up windows "apps" (why do idiots call it APPS?? app = application you use to apply for something, i'm NOT applying for anything!!! those are PROGRAMS) .. anyways even "pc settings" didn't open. after a day i finally got it all back, but windbg STILL NOT WORKING!
in process, i realized that the stupid windows update is required for windows store aswell, so while i enabled it, i let it update.. it WASTED like 2 hours downloading EXTREMELY SLOW (no, internet is FINE, speed test is 800mbit+) and then wanking there for long time "installing", then it rebooted like 3-4 times and YES the hang was there for every single reboot.. then it's "failed to update, undoing changes" .. and wanks there another hour.. WHAT A WASTE OF TIME! what kind of idiot made that update process?
ANYWAYS while claude (and me) thinks this update failing could be related to boot hang, that some core service/file is corrupt or missing and that caused the update to fail aswell, copilot thinks it could be cuz one of the partition that windows makes is too small, it said that it's documented case, BUT i don't see how/why is that an issue? if that's an issue, WHY does win 10 makes 100mb partition to begin with? if that's the case.. EVERY win 10 update should fail cuz every win 10 install makes that 100mb partition, it's where the BCD file sits.
either way i'm not going to jerk with those updates again, microSHIT doesn't know how to make updates, they're INCOMPETENT and LAZY .. and PROOF of that is that it STILL has words like "insert floppy" and/or "insert media into CD-ROM drive" when it poops out on something. it happened when i tried getting rid of old windows kits installation. that's PROOF that it's lazy programming, they're STILL taking bits and pieces from win xp days where floppy was a thing.. a floppy is like 2.7mb size.. NOTHING modern fits there.
but now i'm back where i started, win dbg not working and still boot hanging, but at least i ruled out lot of stuff in meanwhile.
i also used "device cleanup tool" that removes disconnected devices from windows (seen in device manager) and removed more old drivers, i'm fairly certain this hang is due something simple i disabled, but i just CAN'T remember what it was!
CAUSE & FIX:
I was CLOSE! my original theory was "windows doesn't like something and it throws a tantrum", well quite close to the truth!
It didn't like AutoKMS, i'm still not sure if that was original cause as i still use AutoKMS, BUT the problem was that something spammed this key:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\WPA
there were like millions of subkeys and it's part of windows' activation/licencing service. it was flooded with keys and it just choked on it during boot. pretty much as i said.. windows throwing a tantrum!
i figured it out by using windbg (windows debugger) and i hit "break" right during the hang and then got the dumps, more specifically:
ffff950f`caa05f10 fffff806`3020f4f5 : ffff818a`3cc7a040 ffff950f`caa06870 00000000`00000002 00000000`00000000 : nt!NtLockProductActivationKeys+0x34d
I didn't write windows, i'm still bit confused WTF was it doing. AI sorted thru the output within seconds and pointed out the cause and instantly told me to check that WPA registry key:
i think it maxed at 999999 keys and that was enough to choke it.
FIX is easy, delete all that spam, BUT it's not as easy as you think, cuz it's kernel-locked, i tried pstools and ran CMD as SYSTEM (which is why i have permissions open aswell), but nothing worked.
there probably IS a way to delete it from active/running system, but i found it easier to just pull the SSD out and edit it offline using these commands:
reg load HKLM\VMSystem Z:\Windows\System32\config\system
reg delete HKLM\VMSystem\WPA /f
reg add HKLM\VMSystem\WPA /f
reg unload HKLM\VMSystem
where Z = drive letter of your mounted drive. i tested it on 3 drives and it fixed the boot hang on all of them. It's safe to say that was the cause and fix.
BUT i still don't know what caused the flood, i can only assume it's cause AutoKMS was fighting with windows defender. i deleted entire defender cuz it wouldn't leave me alone, even tho it said DISABLED, it STILL managed to run background scans .. it keeps SCANNING AND SCANNING AND SCANNING .. JUST STOP IT! LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE! anyways .. i did that before, i connected drive via USB again and just DELETED the fucking defender files, now it's GONE! i can't stand that shit.. it was doing same on my old media laptop, it kept on SCANNING AND SCANNING and since that old laptop has only some dual core i3, it goes to coma while it scans on background.
WHY is windows SO INTRUSIVE? i fucking hate it!
also i asked AI how did it know what caused the hang in debugger and it said it isn't even documented by microsoft, it gained that knowledge from reverse engineering and debugging! if it wasn't for AI .. i probably wouldn't even figured out which exact thing was causing it. I would have had to go thru them one at a time, but eventually i would have probably found it.
FINAL UPDATE:
the sppsvc spamming the WPA keys was caused by broken windows activator, something got corrupt. i used kmspico/autokms and it had some legacy task scheduled that didn't show up in task scheduler, but AI managed to sniff it out with some command, it was waking sppsvc every minute, which is why/how it clogged up so fast. i'm now using MAS which is just a script that uses windows' own activation process.
i'm STILL not 100% sure why/how it was set to 1 minute update, i THINK it's cuz i disabled windows updates and that stupid activation process relies on update service, so i had to enable it briefly and let it activate and then i killed it again. i THINK that's the end of this, if it clogs up again then fix is easy > unplug drive > connect via usb > run the WPA delete > re-add > done. takes 5 mins or less.
i'm using kms on other PCs aswell and they never had this issue, so it must have been something that triggered this registry spam.. AS I SAID years ago.. "it's probably something i disabled and windows didn't like it and now it's throwing a tantrum" < EXACTLY THAT. it was windows' own activation process/service that broke itself and then started spamming. kms may or may not have started this, it could have also been win defender fighting with kms. either way i blame windows.. stupid system.