PATRON TAKES - Star Trek TNG - Season 2 Episode 18

Nothing says how much of a mixed bag Season 2 is like this episode. Feels like it's a TOS episode, predict you guys will love O'Brien and Riker in this.

I love the "Oh, no!" from O'Brien as he beams up a transporter pad full of Irish stereotypes. As if his character had read the script in advance and knew what we were all in for.

Man, I hate this episode first you got the Irish stereotypes as SF debris, put it, but then the worst part is Riker and Pulaski straight up commit murder yes I know that the clones assaulting them and taking their DNA was definitely wrong and they shouldn’t have done that but to then go and commit murder on those clones who are innocent is just so morally wrong. Also, the clones being opposed to sexual reproduction, at least at first is also stupid since that would probably help at least so much with the genetic issues plus it’s a lot more fun. Oh and of course we end this episode on everyone has to be polygamous. Man what a stupid episode I would also suggest watching SF debris review of this episode. He has some good insights to.

kind of cringe, and I'm not even Irish

the way we start on this episode is great. very silly and light hearted for a society that has lost its home.. and that Riker charm .. but then clones, kidnapping, mind wipe, and finally polygamy the whole 9 yards.

This is the weird episode of TNG where it’s not a great episode, but for some reason I never skip it on rewatches on season 2. It’s also feels like 2 half episodes as the first half is lighthearted and the second half is stark and deals with the metaphysics of cloning.

So, about those bad season two episodes... Wow, this episode has not aged well at all! As I recall it wasn't that well regarded back when it first aired either.

I think it was a nice touch that the women got 3 husbands, instead of the more commonly seen man with 3 wives situation.

What we learned about Klingons in this episode- They do NOT faint, they do NOT give into illness, Klingon measles are no joke, they have a surprisingly beautiful tea ceremony, they prefer to die with others, they write love poetry, Klingon women have traits similar to Brenna Odell, Chech'tluth is not for lightweights.

"Madam, have you ever considered working in security?" One of my favorite lines from Worf up to that point.

This is one of those episodes in which I laugh and bow to the absurdity as Picard did. :)

Well, I’ve done more than my fair share of drinking Irish whiskey, and standing in the fire so that’s not an invalid question, Mr. wharf!

Oh boy. This one is pretty bad, what with the "drunken Irish layabouts" stereotyping and all. What's worse is the forced resolution that OUR CREW endorses. "Eh, y'all should just bang." A low point in the season IMO.

Although this episode is somewhat maligned today, it has been one of my very favorite episodes since I saw it back when it first aired. It also has one of the most cold/badass lines Pulaski has ever spoken.

I've always enjoyed this one, despite the crazy Irish stuff. The idea of cloning against your will is an interesting question, and Pulaski really works with this story.

Oh it’s the Irish immigrants episode. Oh boy buckle up boys. This one is still a bit of heat from most Irish people (I mean real Irish not Irish Americans)

I'm starting to think that Riker could rizz a potted plant if he really wanted to.

Let's see if Pulaski covering for Worf and Klingon tea ceremony scene finally warms them up to her character.

Pulaski gets my highest marks this time: she not only [dutifully] keeps patient secrets (while - comically - crossing her fingers when reporting to Picard about Worf's condition) but also shows remarkable courage and a genuine fascination for alien cultures - witness her partaking in the Klingon Tea Ritual. (That's one of my favorite TNG moments.) This story shows Dr. Pulaski's strengths on full display, particularly her profound respect for doctor-patient confidentiality, as well as respectful love for people encountered by the Enterprise-D. That lady is full of pleasant surprises!

"Up the Long Ladder" quickly turns into a delightful and complicated story with many levels: Comedy, Intrigue, Conspiracy and more, all rolled into a 40-minute romp. The somewhat spooky part has a unique resolution, leaving viewers shaking their heads in agreement with Picard's statement to Pulaski: "I must be of my mind!"

About Brenna Odell. .... What a powerhouse of a woman! That lady is wickedly strong-willed and stern when it comes to dealing with any issue, and quick on her feet in decision-making. Imagine her as Worf's assistant Security Chief on board - she would be absolutely formidable!

Was that EDDIE MURPHY as one of the clone sets on that planet? I've read rumored reports that it was, and also that it wasn't. (He is a Star Trek fan and was almost cast as the whale biologist in ST: IV The Voyage Home, but as we know, that didn't happen.)

After the Bringloidi guests left the Enterprise, how many eggs do you think were found that the little girl's chicken laid in the corridors...?

Geordi just casually mentions that he has 'polygraph vision' in this episode. No biggie.

The REAL worth of this episode is not the episode itself, but the conversations that it sparks afterwards about the hypotheticals presented - cloning, killing of clones, propagation of a species without sex, medically-prescribed polygamy, and even the purposeful sharing of a near-death experience as a form of intimacy. You gotta admit, NO ONE does a better job at spurning conversations about hypotheticals as well as Star Trek! This is why I love it so much!

Call-um Meany has stated in an interview that most Irish characters in film and TV aren't actually performed by Irish actors, and that he's proudly one of the few. He explains that this is why his Irish accent doesn't sound "sing-songy" like what most people think and Irish accent is. He blames Hollywood for perpetrating the fake, over-the-top "Irish" accent and cites this episode as an example (the actors who play the "Irish" colonists and have speaking parts are actually British).

The European Hegemony mentioned early in the episode was the writer's prediction of what basically became the European Union that exists today.

So, Riker figures out an alien SOS, negotiates a planet-wide evacuation, has a romance with a woman he just met, gets abducted and assaulted against his will, and casually murders a clone of himself and Dr. Pulaski. You know, just a normal, regular day. At least we dodged the bullet of two Pulaskis. (JK, the tea scene is the best scene in the episode.)

The clones are humans. What right do they have to murder them anymore than the right to murder your identical twin?

Picard 'breaking' and laughing at the absurdity was an unexpected highlight. He's slowly coming out of his shell.

The goofy Irish crap is just as “racist” as code of honor. It is funny that the cast don’t unanimously condemn this episode. That being said, I love the scenes with Pulaski and Worf.

Clones? ..... Clones? ..... CLONES.

This episode is a tonal roller coaster. You wouldn't expect goofy Irish stereotype gags followed by being abducted for your DNA and then killing unborn clones of yourselves to be in one episode, but there you are!

I can only imagine Irish people watching this cringe as badly at these accents as I do with Scotty's accent in TOS. At least Scotty was a great character!

This one makes me roll my eyes like I'm a 14-year-old

For me it's...not one of their best. Your buddy Colm Meaney hates it because of the Irish stereotypes. The clone jokes get old pretty quickly. On the other hand, Worf and Pulaski have some nice bonding moments. My ranking for this one is “At Least It's Only 45ish Minutes”.

How? How did you manage to have the single most offensively stereotypical Irish episode of TNG land so that its access dates will bracket St Patrick's Day? Well done, lads, I suppose.

I love this one. I don't care what anyone else says. It is fun and hits a topic that was a huge deal at the time, cloning

“Lucky Charms! They’re magically delicious!.” I loathed this episode. It had potential to address some moral issues in that Star Trek way, but nope. Occasional heavy handed lines taking the place of thoughtfulness or cleverness. Caricatures instead of characters. It felt lazy all the way through. This coulda been good but felt slapped together. Swing and a very big miss. Ugh.

This is probably me being too easy on TNG again but I like this episode. Depictions of Irish people going cross eyed drinking booze aside, it has some fun siliness, great scenes with Worf and Pulaski, and even a bit of body horror in the kidnapping/cloning scenes

One of those "so bad it's good" episodes for me.

Ah, TNG's other racist episode! I'm pretty sure Pulaski's math about 3 wives and 3 husband's actually makes the second or third generation basically all first cousins and super defeats the purpose. But, as someone with significant Irish ancestry myself, I gotta admit our stereotypes are fun at least.

After the last episode I was wrong…. It got worse colm meaney probably thought they were taking the piss with this script… and that feet scene

Yikes. Along with the last episode, I'm tempted to skip this one too but I will watch because through you guys I always see something of value.

People get up in arms about this episode, and I'm forced to ask them: "What, people like this didn't exist? This is an exaggeration??" And the real answer is "Yes they do exist," and "No it is not an exaggeration." We'd all be lucky to have a Brenna Odell in our lives. And that is NOT what "racist" means.

Man between this and Attack of the Clones, I dunno which one makes me want vent myself out to space more. The Clone Wars it ain't.

Irish man Colm Meaney getting the script for this episode: "What the £#€% is this $#!+?"

From Memory Alpha: The episode title, "Up The Long Ladder," derives from an expression, "Up the long ladder and down the short rope," a reference to the gallows in an Irish rhyme popularized in Tommy Makem's song, "Are You Ready for a War?" Writer Snodgrass remarked, "It was intended to be a commentary about immigration ... I wanted it to be something that says ‘sometimes those outsiders you think are so smelly and wrong-colored can bring enormous benefits to your society because they bring life and energy.’ That's what I was going for." Snodgrass's boss at the time, Maury Hurley, was "a major Irishman" and loved the idea of an Irish-themed people with lots of energy.

I actually like this episode a lot, despite it's flaws. I think the Irish lady, Brenna, Phan Farred with Riker mainly to put some fresh blood into their DNA pool. (Women will do that, consciously and unconsciously).

It is worth researching exactly where this episode's title is taken from. It is another example of just how misconceived this episode is. I'm serious, who ever provided the title of this episodes needed a dressing down from any responsible adult connected with making the show.

The look of pride Picard has when Riker immediately guesses "SOS?" is very refreshing.

Another episode where I like Pulaski! She's finally developing well. The Tea Ceremony is great. But overall, this episode is memorable for ... Space Irish. Yes, the space irish. This feels like a half-baked TOS episode, but for TNG, ugh.

How do you feel about Riker essentially murdering his clone? What sort of precedent does that set for the human rights of clones, so soon (relatively) after Measure of a Man establishing rights for androids?

If memory serves the original title of the episode was “Send in the clones”

I liked this one alot...Worf with measles, the Klingon Tea Ceremony and the Irish Colony. Riker gets another Girl and the Actress who plays Brenna Odell (Rosalyn Landor) is gorgeous. She is my Fav part of this one! You guys should get a kick out of this one. That's it! 🖖😀

It’s the Irish Episode!! ☘️ 🇮🇪

a mix of stereo types and a ridiculous scenario, combined with serious commentary on real issues - in some ways this is pure star trek, even if it isn't the best episode (IMO) - i do want to give Pulaski a chance every time i see her, but only kinda sorta do i like her, this episode shows a good side of her tho and of course Ryke and his mischevious smile ...

Riker.. outdoing Kirk

If you thought we left comical Irish stereotypes behind with Riley and Finegan in TOS, think again! Woo boy, now this is a bad episode, one of my least favorite of the whole series. One moment that particularly bothers me is when Riker and Pulaski straight up murder their clones without batting an eye! I will grant that it had one good line: "Haven't you ever seen a woman before?" "I THOUGHT I had!"

It should tell you something that the noted Irish crewman, CHAD O'Brien, didn't have anything to do with this episode outside of work the transporter. "Mr O'Brien, can you translate for us?" "No sir, I'm afraid they're far too racist for me simple brogue ACCHHHH!" (that's the rumored script they cut)

I do like that Riker got Pulaski's consent before murdering her clone

I like this one

For like 96% of the episodes, I can look at the title and remember everything that happens, for about 3% of episodes I might need to read a synopsis line. Like with the previous episode "Samaritan Snare? What was that? Oh, the Pakleds, now I remember it, yes." With this episode.....i legit do not remember anything at all. I know I've seen it because I vaguely remember Worf attempting to poison Pulaski, but she came prepared (so close). But I don't remember that as a part of this episode, i just remember that it happened. Everything about the A-plot has escaped me. I think that means this episode isn't that good.

But DID Picard ever find all of their Lucky Charms?

Up the lung laddah? Mo' like Up yer lung 'ahs! Aye, we be makin' Irish jokes fo deyyyysss! It's only mildly racist.

Noones said it yet, so allow me.. Ahem.. THE RIIIIIZZZZZ!!!

Always enjoyed this episode, it's got great humour, a bit more klingon lore but in all honesty you could transplant this story into TOS and not bat an eyelid.

The only good scene in this episode is Worf and Pulaski drinking the tea.

IRELAND! Oh and clones… yeah that’s all

A hoot of an episode, kind of harkens back to TOS. The solution with the females having to take on several lovers for the survival of the race made me chuckle because I had to think it was good old Gene Roddenberry that came up with that.

Sweet Jesus, Mary & Joseph. It's 'The Quiet Man' tropes mixed in with (what I think is meant to be) a Northern Ireland parallel. The other 'colony' could be the Protestant Community (i.e. birth control = cloning & lack of DNA variation = population decline). We Irish just rolled our eyes when this was broadcast. It's lazy, hackneyed 'Oirish' stereotypes. Once described as "a colossal mess", this episode rates with the most embarrassing of ST as a whole.

Melinda Snodgrass going from measure of a man to this? Guess they all can't be bangers

I feel like introducing the Irish to Klingon fire wine is just setting them up for failure in their new colony.

If you watch in release order, Star Trek V should be next. I enjoy that more than this episode. At least this episode features O’Brien.

Honestly, I think this episode is far more blatantly prejudiced than "Code of Honor." Every one of those people are the most stereotypical Irish people you've ever seen.

I call this episode a guilty pleasure. It does make me ask this question and I'd like to know your thoughts: In the future, if we have "cheap" spacecraft to take us to the stars, do we just fling ships out into the far reaches and hope for the best?

Alex, your boy Colm Meaney, proud Irishman, said he hated this episode for obvious reasons.

"Tree oehsbands per persahn ya say? Oi'll take deese tree Eddie Moehrphy's den."

This one is almost as reviled as Code of Honor. And for good reason too.

"Racist" O'Brien should feel right at home with this one.

We may be exploring the stars and expanding the possibilities of our own existence, but no matter what, the "funny" drunk Irish stereotype is still alive and well.