805 - My First Genocide feat. Ali Abunimah (2/8/24)
Today, executive director of the Electronic Intifada Ali Abunimah joins us to discuss the war in Palestine. We cover recent attempts to delegitimize and destroy UNRWA, atrocity propaganda, evolving capabilities of Palestinian resistance, changing attitudes towards Israel in the U.S., and the life, career and death of Palestinian author Refaat Alareer.
Find the Electronic Intifada here: https://electronicintifada.net/
And on YouTube here: https://www.youtube.com/@TheElectronicIntifada
You can find Gaza Writes Back, the short story collection edited by Refaat Alareer, here: https://justworldbooks.com/books-by-title/gaza-writes-back/
Comments (138)
The people I'm around daily are the type to try to make you seem crazy or depraved for understanding the things discussed here. It is exhausting. Thank you all for doing this.
This was beautiful, thank you!
Israel also losing the war in the comments. Powerful ep.
best ep in a while. bravo. would love to see this guest again
amazing - one of the best things ive ever heard in my life. Thank you
This was a really amazing episode, thank you. Sometimes i get distracted while listening and dont process everything, but I was glued for this.
THANK YOU for putting this outside the paywall! LOVE YOU GUYS - hope Matt is recovering well.
Refusing to see that yeah some Palestinians do horrible things despite their cause being just enables not just those specific acts, but serves to prevent any actual change. Part of how capitalism remains unchanged. Those who are able to identify some of the root problems, like Chapo, voice themselves in such a way that makes sure they ignore "the bad stuff" and so remain unable to influence whats actually going on. I can see christman for example understanding this
Do you really think that Hamas is somehow more influenced by powerless pro-palestine western opinion than by elite pro-zionist consensus, to say nothing of the army occupying their land? No one, as far as I can tell, has described any of the resistance groups as "the most moral army." The polarization is skewed so far in the opposite direction that it's almost impossible to make a useful comparison.
Outstanding episode
What a magnificent episode. Hats off. Powerful.
Because they abuse human rights. How obtuse are you? No one in the thread questions that. I’m saying in this instance they’re **also** hosting and urging investigation of video showing Hamas wantonly slaughtering cars full of civilians.
Israeli money being put to work in these comments
أوه، ها! إنه يعرف الأسوأ!
You guys should get Max Blumenthal on to explain his articles and coverage of the war. He has been debunking IDF claims every week. I also think he does a good job of highlighting the sick parts of Israeli culture that are feasting on this slaughter.
Excellent episode. Ali and EI do great work.
This was an awful episode filled with propaganda. Hamas is winning the war? 🤣 Cope harder
This was a really powerful episode, fellas. Thank you all for sincerely engaging with Palestine and bringing electronic Intifada on. This and Felix's interview a few years ago with Mohammad Alsaafin and the episode with Mark Ames I've listened on repeat in recent weeks.
Uh, Ali, the GDR hired Nazis and staffed most of the KDP,the government bureaucracy, and the courts just like the Bonn Republic lol. No offense my man,but to pretend otherwise is whitewashing.
Unfortunately the IDF and Israel are often linked to Nazis. There was a photo going around today which featured an IDF training facility and a member with a tattoo of the Sonnenrad
Adding to the call for unlocking this ep
so this guys says nothing bad happened on Oct 7 then?! this beyond the pale even for there guys. enough to get them demonetized for sure
being this dumb is like being dead: you don't know it but it hurts everyone around you
Wow guys, this interview was one I enjoyed most from CTH. Ali is amazing. Thanks for doing this.
I loved this episode. Ali - Thank you for all you do.
🔥
I'm a woman, have been a subscriber since 2016 and have rolled my eyes at every single dumb Chapo sexism scandal but the rape denialism is very disturbing to me. I get the critique of rape propaganda but the idea that it didn't happen at all is just crazy
When Liz Franczak was on to talk about this she sort of pulled you back from the edge. I think that was a good instinct
🖤❤️🔥🖤❤️🔥🖤❤️🔥
Bruh that poem 😭
That sounded like Brian Cox reading it, yes?
Need to hear Jon Elmer and Felix talking about al-Qassam Brigades footage, the military wing of Hamas.
Agreed, would love to hear Felix and John Elmer talking resistance
For someone claiming to dislike Israel, one of the patron is really advocating for IDF in the comments. They are screaming about it the allegations of Hamas’ rape based one or two videos (that may or may not exist/fabricated/be true). While blatantly ignoring the systematic evidence of rape of Palestinian women by IDF and the settlers over the past 75 years.
I’m not advocating for idf. I have not denied a single thing the idf has done in the history of Israel. I referenced only what this guest alleged in this episode.
This episode needs to be unlocked
I did it, cancelled my subscription to the New York Times!
I couldn’t believe my eyes when I saw you guys had Ali as a guest and the episode did not disappoint. I was just thinking today what a bummer not having Matt around since I became a subscriber but showcasing electronic intifada to our fellow Western socialists and fellow chapo stans has reinvigorated my faith! Well done 👍
Part of me thinks it's better for Matt's health that he has to sit this one out.
Where did I say Hamas beheaded babies? I specifically said the opposite. You’re either disingenuous or illiterate. You’ve had too much college, dude. The college, in my day, wasn’t so strong. But the college today? Way too strong.
Genuinely curious, what do you think “college” has to do with this? Something I never learned about in college is the word in Hebrew that means “explaining”, have you ever heard of it?
If ALs parents were releasing footage of them hosing civilians and firing RPGs into cars full of people I’d be more willing to believe they also committed sexual violence. Hamas fighters themselves posted this stuff. “Oh yeah they were engaged in wanton murder (or “resistance”) but they’d never rape women so the videos of them doing the killing and filming the raped women must actually be IDF soldiers amongst the flag waving Hamas soldiers on their motorcycles thanking god without Israeli accents. Extremely noble take. Israel is an apartheid state. It’s awful. I like Chapo a lot (less post Christman) but their completely understandable disgust at Israel and the ethnic cleansing have suspended their typically reasoned evaluation of discrete events within the conflict. I’ll just phrase it like that.
Can you guys just give this guy his $5 dollars back. Ffs.
Please unlock this one. I have so many family members who are in support of Israel who need to hear from this man.
Excellent episode. Thank you for sharing EI with the audience. I agree it should be opened up to all
Make this one public guys. There's friends I want to send this to
Great interview, wish this one wasn’t paywalled
Y'all should put this one out to the public.
Would anyone have a link to the statistic mentioned 68 minutes into this weeks show about Germany treatment of anti-zionist Jews?
Please unlock this one, great episode
As a German it has been a wretched experience the last months. I had thought that we were taught that genocide is bad and that "Never Again" is a call for a world without fascism and genocide. Turns out, it is was me who misunderstood the lesson: It is not that genocide is bad, but that you mustn't do it to white people and that "Never Again" means no guy with a toothbrush mustache ever again. Silly me.
“You don’t have time to rape when you expect a counter attack” is a completely bullshit take. Please tell this to women who were raped in school bathrooms, poorly lit parking lots, in alleys. It can be over in under a minute. “There is no evidence of rape”. Besides first hand witness accounts as well as footage posted by Gazans and Hamas fighters on social media bragging about it. I love Chapo but this supposed expert didn’t even look? Im not fucking w/ Israel, I’m not a fan, USA should not fund them, but this guy is cooking with BS. “How do you knock down a house with ak47” idk dude, like 2 RPGs? This guys sounds completely enamored and infatuated with Hamas.
There is 0 evidence of rape. You can keep pretending otherwise but the episode addresses it. El zilcho. Joe Biden didn't even see a picture of it next to all the dead baby heads. A rapist preying on women when they go to the bathroom is a bit different than a soldier in the middle of a guerilla war operation expecting and in fact experiencing air and armor counter attack. I am glad to see IJDF purchasing chapo subscripts. Keep doing what you're doing, it is worth it to change some hearts n minds. "First" hand accounts." Lmao
my stance is that Israel should have been located in Kaliningrad
Unlock this so I can send it to my mum pls
Can we get some discussion on the pod about how Israel is transitioning from killing via bombs to killing via hunger and disease? I feel like the 40,000 deaths or more we've seen up to this point are going to be only the start, if Israel is allowed to continue its current strategy.
I don't think evangelical Christians lost support for Israel because they marketed themselves as gay. They're just using Israel as canon fodder to help trigger the apocalypse. Doing gay shit might even help
Oh Evangelical God loves to blow up cities because they got gays in em
Snooze fest. Did appreciate that the last couple episodes weren't all gaza though. But if you want to hear a bunch of terrible shit in a un funny matter this is for you
would you have preferred yochin
feels like a return to form, always love the fun eps, but really missed hearing from people on the ground of various struggles like this. thank you thank you thank you
very rare event where on the same day CTH makes me want to off myself and Radio War Nerd offers me a comforting blend of movie mindset takes
Incredible interview, thank you.
Who reads the poem at the end?
I believe it's Brian Cox; it's also on YouTube.
incredible episode! maybe a future Jon Elmer ep. Felix and him can discuss the resistance in depth just a thought
Excellent excellent excellent
An episode I send my parents
+1 to unlock this one. Fantastic guest, amazing episode that more people need to be able to hear.
I agree this should be a free episode. Feed us patreons the unimportant but entertaining slop and make these widely available
GDR is best Germany. Germany is only cool when the collective Slavic gun is pointing at their head.
Ali is correct that it is a Member of the British Columbian provincial Legislative Assembly that is stepping down in Canada (Selina Robinson). Worse than her comments is her party affiliation: she's NDP, our historically Social-Democratic party, and was a Cabinet Minister too. With a Left like this, who needs a Right?
The ep will be unlocked by Monday
You guys seriously rule.
20:00 HEY FELIX IS ON THIS TOO!
Great episode. Unlock please!
Unlock this shit
guys please unlock this so we can spread it far and wide. Ali is one of the best we have
Joining the chorus here: please unlock this ep. I don't know if anything makes a difference anywhere anymore, but I know folks that could stand to hear this.
Must unlock
If anyone is interested in sitreps from the Palestinian perspective, might want to check out The Anti-Empire Project on YT - also of course Jon Elmer does a great job on this on EI streams.
This guest was amazing. Brilliant episode, and Will is an excellent interviewer.
wow my home province made the pod, such an honour. one of the only pieces of good news recently, Robinson lost her cabinet position within days of her comments.
Gotta unlock this one.
really good episode
Refaat's poem at the end. It would bring tears to a stone.
Try to scare democrats into stopping the genocide by phonebanking for Listen to Michigan between now and Feb 27. Listentomichigan dot com.
On one side we have Refaat Alareer's "If I Die Let it Bring Hope," and on the other we have a nebbishy chad-wannabe Israeli rapper shouting "We're gonna kill you, Dua Lipa!" (approx.) and topping the Israeli charts.
A monstrous, evil state without a shred of culture. Man, the Israelis learned everything they could from the British Empire
My eyes were burning listening to the tribute to Rifat
Living through the early 90s, let me tell you no one could ever have guessed that Hillary Clinton would eventually become one of the most despicable people on the face of the earth — nor one of the most tiresome. She truly unites almost everyone across the American political spectrum.
What was the excerpt at the end ? It’s familiar but I can’t place it.
Brian Cox reading Refaat Alareer's poem "If I Must Die".
Felix put all his stat points into foreign punditry and MMA trivia. Let him finish.
And Dark Souls lore
On the subject of Germany. I went to brush up on my history and the Nuremburg Laws show as repealed. Fascism won WW2.
not my joke but NATO = Nazis After the Trials were Over
I think this episode should be unlocked. Don't stop talking about Gaza.
Agreed. This one is important.
Mr President, it seems we have allowed a mine shaft gap
The sadism is the point.
I'm really glad y'all brought on Ali! The Electronic Intifada has been a brilliant outlet for understanding all issues around Palestine for a long time
Great ep
ive been listening to EI for a while now, was so pumped to see Ali as a guest.
It would be amazing to be able to share this ep outside the pay wall. So many pro Palestine supporters need condensed information like this.
100%
You guys should unlock this one, it's excellent
Love waking up to a fresh cup of Chapo
is that f murray abraham at the end?
Oh fuck off... That's Brian Cox!
I’ve been listening to Chapo for years and you guys are very close to my heart. So is Ali Abunimah and the crew from EI. Having you finally together, talking about Palestine, is like hearing my soul out loud. Thank you all so much. Hope you can reconvene soon.
Fantastic interview as always. I always appreciate when Chapo cuts through the humour and gets down to the nub of an issue. I also loved hearing the description of the Palestinian hyperloop. Incredible
I've always known that Israeli society is deeply propagandized, but the way ordinary Israelis talk about UNWRA and the Palestinian refugees who work for them has been really revolting. Especially when they talk about how lucky and entitled Palestinians are to inherit refugee status. They are foaming at the mouth to have that status revoked from some of the most vulnerable people in the world.
“Look at the free blankets and hot soup those pampered tornado victims are getting! Nooo!!”
People keep saying Hamas has all these tunnels which survive bombardment and allow them to pop up next to tanks. I don't know if I believe that given I have seen no such videos. I suspect there is a period of time in which aerial scanning is impeded and they entrench during those periods. If that is the case this will continue indefinitely because there is nothing to destroy. They can only kill a man as it were.
it's suspected by the IDF and their american leash holders an estimated 80% of the tunnel network remains intact and usable by the resistance.
Uh oh! Daniel Hepburn and Sparky aren’t gonna enjoy this episode!
Who the fuck are they
Imagine believing accusations from people that can't truthfully read a blank calendar. Oh and jerk off corpses, because seriously what the fuck?
Wow, great to hear Ali on here!
@50 min a beautiful eulogy for a fellow poster
great guest and episode I teared up during the Refaat discussion, I never even interacted with him online let alone knew the man, but I think about him every day
Always appreciate hearing Ali 🤗
please unlock this episode
I second this motion.
Happy midnight to Scandinavia from New Mexico, U.S.A.
Love for Ali and EI ♥️
Might be too little too late but does anyone know of a good org to donate to for Gaza?
Palestine Red Crescent Society
Let's get some "Chris W"s going in the chat boys and girls!
Extremely common dub
Good Morning fr. Scandinavia
No I wasn’t refreshing Patreon on my couch at 1 in the morning you can’t prove anything
Still not first. Rip
Thank you Chris!
Second
An admirable effort
Oh shit.. my refreshing worked