8-Track Changer Fix-up
I’ve played about with quite a few cassette changers over the years, but now it’s time to take a look at a five-cart 8-track changer.
Quite a few 8-track changers were released - I’ve got another more elaborate one in storage that I need to take a look one day too. As you’ll see in this video though, the simple nature of the 8-track play mechanism lent the format to multi-cartridge machines. Cassette changers required far more elaborate solutions (like a ski slope).
Oh and I must apologise, I know this will generate complaints when the video goes live, but there was nothing I could do about it. I do sound rather bunged up during sections of this video. This occurred on the days preceding a hospital appointment when I wasn’t able to take any remedies to mask the issue. It was either a bunged up video or no video.
Enjoy the week and I hope to have a new video for you soon. Take care.
UPDATE
Re-uploaded the video to remove a section where I said 50hz instead of 60hz - also took this opportunity to minimise pedant magnets though the smattering in of a few verbalisations of things that whilst common sense, were previously unspoken.
Comments (70)
Bit late joining the convo here, but very impressive repair job :-) A couple of hints.. If the motor runs off mains voltage, it's almost certainly a synchronous motor and speed is determined by line frequency (having the frequency printed on the motor is also a clue).. The switch used for selecting heads is the type used on multimeters. The secret to cleaning is to use a pencil eraser (rubber) then smear vaseline onto the pcb to discourage oxidation. Also, if you measure the diameter of the motor shaft with a caliper, you can find odd pulleys on eBay; might get one that just works. I was going to suggest you could build a 60Hz 110V supply using an American inverter and alarm battery, but you literally were reading my thoughts at that exact moment,..
Hello Techmoan. I would have a cheap, easy and lasting suggestion on how to fix the speed of the 8-Track in your recent video. I do CAD drawing as a bit of a hobby, so if you send me the current measurements of the part which is driving the belt I should be able the create a CAD drawing with the correct measurements to make it run with the right speed. Since there is not particularly much strain on this part you should then be able to just print the model out on a 3d printer (there are many services with which you can do this nowadays, both online and in shops, sometimes even for free in libraries, universities etc.) and install it on the motor. Theoretically I could even print it out and send it to you since I have a 3d printer myself, but since I live in Germany I think the other options would probably be simpler and cheaper. I always enjoy watching your Videos and would be glad to help you out with this. 😊
Looks like you have been featured on Hack A Day. This used to be massive and has know to create a massive spike in views and even crash servers in the past. Unfortunately it looks like it doesn’t have that much of an effect nowadays. https://hackaday.com/2022/07/25/50-year-old-8-track-changer-repair-and-hack/
Years ago when I was starting out I had one of my videos mentioned on Gizmodo and it really boosted that month massively. The last time this happened it made zero difference. You can understand why I stopped updating my website. The audience shifted elsewhere.
Although as usual, late to the party, I enjoyed this one too, quite a bit. A thing with your "repair" videos is that I often have questions that you explain along. You do great descriptions on the functionality of these things and do a very good functional description and process. I thought at the very beginning that you might have an engineering background on DFMA and as it seems you don't, I have a lot of respect for you there. It is also fun sometimes to have to admit, I sometimes think " too modern". I wondered how the switching was made between the heads but I thought mostly on electronic terms. So I particularly enjoy your answers to my sometimes haphazard formulated questions. The speed issue though, you can do some maths on it, but the tape method necessarily means trial and error. I can feel your pain putting that thing together. I have little patience (I started building models to train it) So it matters little to me that your fixes are not all that robust because it's the functional side I am interested on. After all, the robustness is your problem... It's your device after all😊 Another answered question was the calibration. I thought you might use an oscilloscope offline... And I guess before digital music that was the way to do it
Watching again now that it's public. Holy cow, you had to put a LOT of tape on that pulley to *get the country music to stop*. Glad you didn't run out. :-)
Please tell me that you've survived Heatpocalypse in a fair to middling condition. I'm also curious about Mr Naughty, is he still around?
Still here - still working, although I took the hot days off, so I'm a bit behind. It turned out that Naughty is a female - hence the dropping of Mr from the name. I didn't want to call it Mrs Naughty because it sounds wrong. But yes it still visits most days - I bought a squirrel feeder so it can help itself and it only takes one or two nuts each visit now - must be on a diet.
Hi Mat, if you ever need narrow tape again, you may find Kapton tape useful. It's very thin and smooth, and it's sold in different widths from 4mm up.
I'd seen it online but had no idea about it - is is sticky enough?
I was going to say that that didn't sound a thing like Al Hirt!
In your videos I always thought you were saying "cellotape" as in short for "cellophane tape". I didn't know it was a brand name, and spelled Sellotape. The American equivalent is Scotch tape, another genericized trademark.
BBC Children’s programmes were always using it to construct things when I was growing up - due to the rules about advertising they called it ‘sticky tape’ but it sounded weird. We do get Scotch brand tape too but the name is rarely spoken.
Hey Mat. Just want to say I hope you're staying safe in the oven over there across the pond.
Today is supposed to be the really hot one - there definitely won’t be much work getting done here.
Mat... I've spotted you in a shop in 1983! 😊 https://youtu.be/VzBI6v1vLs4&t=20s Edit: and, effective updates to your video as well 👍🏻 hope you are keeping cool today 🥵
I..is that actually you, Mat? 😳 Incredible find if true! But I suppose it could be young master Random British Kid, Esq. 😁
The country music on 8-track, coming out of a tape changer from the 70s, reminded me of a wood-panelled and vinyl upholstered american diner that I've never even been in. 😳 Also enjoyed the cliffhanger. Same Mat-time, same Mat-channel? 😁 Everybody Hertz, as the song goes.
I'm surprised that there wasn't a helper spring to lift the head carriage.
It seems the least well thought out part of the whole thing. That plastic wheel is running the whole show.
This really was a very Techmoan video to me again. I loved it! And it worked properly in the end! How you got the speed perfect using normal tape is beyond me. Clearly, you DID develop some skills throughout the years :) Thanks Mat!
One of Mat's best skills is his ability to underestimate himself. :-)
I miss hitting things and having the satisfaction of fixing it! Didn't notice the blocked nose.
The Fonzie method! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mIwTWGOMY0
Very ingenious diagnosis of the speed issue and the resulting repair! You mentioned that you don't consider this to have been a proper repair job. In a "perfect" world would you have retooled that part through 3D printing to achieve the desired thickness? Also, would there be an approach where you'd change out the belt instead? I am thinking there would be several approaches. (Although adding the packing tape layers was very satisfying to watch! I think you must have known that, hence the chill-out music!)
I'm not a 3D printing kind of chap - but if I knew someone incredibly skilled with a lathe maybe they could make a new part out of metal. But they'd need to fashion some screw threads to hold it on as well...I have no idea but it seems complicated. As for the belt - it's doing the job well, so I'd just leave it. It'll probably outlast me.
Very enjoyable video, as usual, Mat! I didn't hear anything "wrong" with your voice. But then, I don't listen to find fault, I listen to go along for the ride. So, thanks for the ride!
Thanks Bruce 👍
I bought a National TE-61 clock/timer from Japan a bit ago (I'm in the States). It was 100V 50Hz. The transformer to step up the voltage was no problem to obtain, but the conversion from 50Hz to 60Hz wasn't as simple as I thought it would be. I found a company (I have no affiliation with them other than I bought their product and it works) called KCC Scientific that makes a frequency converter. I bought the Chronos model, it was $199 US. But it did what I needed and the TE-61 runs accurately. So my $80 TE-61 wound up not being cheap, but it works now like it should.
The other multiplayer you have is much more interesting, and also mechanically more complex, one day you have to get your hands on it
That one scares me a bit - I think I might be out of my depth trying to get it working.
Any day with a new Techmoan vid is a good day!
Really excellent Mat! I love your systematic approach. Am I misremembering or is the head selector device that you cleaned after the second dismantling similar in concept to the one in the Panasonic(?) speaking clock you showed a while back? Have a good week ahead, Mat.
I think it’s the one in the Hipac changer - I didn’t know what that part did at the time, (I might have thought it was some kind of timer) but it all makes sense now.
Your practical approach to repair reminds me of the mindset of one of "Scrapheap Challenge"'s most successful teams: "this thing only has to work for, like, ten or twenty minutes."
That’s exactly what’s going on - like trading in a car, as long as it doesn’t set on fire until you’ve left it behind at the dealership, you’re golden.
I saw someone get around this 50/60 Hz conversion issue with a combination of linear 12V DC power supply and pure sine wave inverter. But I deeply appreciate that you wanted to "do it right" by adapting the equipment itself for more practical use in the UK, and via an easily reversible modification.
You might have even seen me do it https://youtu.be/_dgO0HdPMds
Mat, I've been waiting for this video for a long time! I have a very similar model, and for quite a while, no decent video reviews of it existed, nor much info at all. So, 3 years ago, I took matters into my own hands and made a video myself, which remains my only public YouTube video to this day. Mine is a bit different because it shows off some of the modifications I made to mine (one of which is the "Repeat All" function that you noted was missing) but does not show the repair aspect nor much of the internals. Nonetheless, my video has been surprisingly popular (~5K views/~200 likes) to be my documentary debut and on a channel with no other content. I will definitely link to your video (once it's public) in my description to send people there for more info (not that your channel needs any help). Yours has everything that mine lacks. Thank you! My video for reference: https://youtu.be/sonZBsQTOyk
I’ll watch that this evening, thanks.
While I still enjoy repair videos even if they don't have a "Happy Ending" this one is a very satisfying video with a full story arc: 1) Show the device in it's current unrepaired state & explain how it's supposed to operate. 2) Take it apart and find faults 3) Repair the faults 4) Reassemble and test 5) Correct faults discovered in step 4 6) Demonstrate device in working order I guess you could say there's also a step 7--respond to commenters who tell you that you've done it wrong--hopefully you'll be able to skip this step😉 It's also cool how you've shown that with the right gear, 8-tracks can perform better than we might think they can.
We have an American neighbour he has lots of US stuff. He bought a step down transformer and a 60Hz interruptible power supply for his reel to reel. I think sellotape was a better repair.
Thanks Mat I enjoyed this one. Your voice sounded fine to me. You didn't sound bunged up here.
Terrific video. The format always seemed like kind of a mutt to me and the existence of an 8-track tape changer took me completely by surprise. And your repair videos fill me with a certain kind of awe for mechanical engineering. I grew up coding, so it's natural to think of an operation in terms of "make things happen in a certain sequence, keep checking the state of certain variables, then proceed accordingly." But creating such a program out of gears, springs, motors, solenoids, and simple contact switches feels like a certain kind of alchemy. I can only imagine the kinds of irreplaceable, intuitive institutional knowledge that these design firms accrued over the years.
You certainly got really good at those repairs over the years by doing these over and over again.
Spot on with the speed. You could have made your life a bit easier by using a caliper. The diameter of the wheel needs to be 1.2 times more than it was before.
Great work, good fix, and also interesting to watch, (and no problem with your voice for me.)
Excellent example of mechanized technology's final attempts to be compact and as efficient as electronic and software advancements overtaking their relevance. These remind me also of working on pre-80s cars. You can open it up and "logic out" what is going on. Today, some things work, or don't. Go/no go model.
I’ve come to realise that my hope of fixing something taps-out somewhere in the early 1970s. I might start a slogan ‘if you can see a chip, throw the thing in a skip’
Hey Mat. In my region of the US at record stores there was a section of albums which had apparently not sold well. They went into a reduced price status, and had a notch or corner of the cover cut out. This section of albums for sale was always called "cut outs". As a teen in the 80s, in metro Detroit MI, my pals and I went around to several local stores trying to find cool cut outs!
I had the same experience. Seems like it was a standard industry practice: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cut-out_(recording_industry)
34 minutes of precision tinkering. Perfect for a hot Sunday afternoon.
I’m just glad I got this one out of the way before the coming week’s U.K. heat-based Extinction Level Event. If the heat from all the studio lights were to be added on top that, things might get a bit unpleasant.
That's a very stylish machine with the rotating cart display and hidden illumination for the track. Great to see it fully working again.
Very nice video. Great look into the mechanics of this machine. You are very good in explaining how it all works and showing clear footage of it actually doing its thing. Brilliant how you got the speed to match so well. Thanks to you I know quite a bit about 8-track, considering I have never seen or touched an 8-track cartridge or machine in my life :)
I love a successful troubleshooting video. One conversation point though. Recording a 3KHz tone on a (any) tape for speed adjustment depends on the speed being correct on the recorder you're using. I've been dabbling with this issue for months. I have a 3KHz compact cassette calibration tape and an app on my phone, but I hate that sound, and so does my family. One solution I've found is to use a pre-recorded cassette (like the Phil Collins one) with one headphones ear-bud in one ear, and the same song on my phone with another ear-bud in the other ear. I start the streaming track a little ahead of the tape track, then quickly pause and play the streaming track until the two match. Then I listen until the tape track gets behind or ahead of the streaming track and adjust the speed accordingly. It takes a while, but then I'm sure the player is the correct speed.
The problem with doing something like this on an 8-track is waiting 15 minutes for the song to come around again. Then again if you’re really looking for accuracy…you’re not talking 8-track, might as well throw the whole format in the bin if accuracy of reproduction is a priority. I guess this is going to be a video where I’ll have to stay away from the comments - I get a bit jaded with all the ‘you’re doing it wrong’ stuff. As mentioned in the video - it wasn’t a repair…it’s was just a fix…and it got fixed and it now works well, so I’m happy.
'Superiorly-Edited Precision-Filming of a Mechanism's Clean-Lubricate-Calibrate 8-Track Changer Extravaganza' should be the actual video title. This was a fascinating (for me) look inside a machine like this. That capstan was the biggest surprise for me. Excellent job getting the speed perfect, that was great. It's also interesting that it may have been manufactured by another company for RCA. That original music was frankly hideous at all speeds. I wonder where it was played. Your vocal sound isn't much different than normal. I have been having another TM playlist binge on my TV as a background sound while I do household chores, and your voice sounds as good as always to me. I'm very intrigued by next week's mystery video, and I very much look forward to it.
It’ll be a simpler video than this one - but I needed to get a few things in a row first before I could make it. Oh and the holes…apparently so, but I’ve no personal experience of this.
Great to see a 100% successful result on this repair job.
Many record stores used to the cutting off the corner thing although I used to think it was something to do with customs as our favourite store used to sell mainly Greek imports which were 2/3rds the price of U.K. pressings while being great quality. I recently acquired from my sister music from Easy Rider, where annoyingly in doing so they have also cut through the corner of a large poster that was included leaving it full of diamond shaped holes !
I was almost getting shocked when you did the sellotape (spellotape?!?) job on the motor pulley... It will definitely turn into goo quite soon, but I guess you know from your last comments. I was still surprised how well it works, I expected more flutter, but maybe that isn't so noticeable with 8-track cartridges. It sounded actually very good at the end. One of my Hammond organs actually has a converter, that basically rectifies the incoming 110V (any frequency) and outputs 110V at 60 Hz. The print is apparently a design from a Dutch guy I know and quite large, I could see if I could develop a size-reduced version, maybe you would be interested?
I recently bought a 300WH LiFePO4 power bank with built in sinewave inverter. If you got the US version you would be sorted for a few hours use.
That was really interesting, Mat. Love the fact you got the speed to spot on 100% with Sellotape!
It was bit of a surprise…I would have been happy to settle on +- 2%
Oh while you’re here. I was just browsing ebay and found this brilliantly crap robot https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125418946532 - I just had to share it…but no I’m not buying it. I leave it for some other ‘lucky’ bidder.
Holy cow that's where I am! Not buying it though :)
Fascinating video … I discovered this week that for sone reason the Royal Navy uses 60Hz on its kit …. Which lead me into researching the differences between 50 and 60 and who uses what. What blew me away was the fact that Japan uses both 50 and 60 depending which island you’re one - which seems even more bonkers!
As I recall this stems from the 19th century when the electricity generation company in the east of Japan bought a 50hz generator from Europe (AEG in Germany) and built the grid out from there. Whereas the western company bought a 60hz generator from the USA (General Electric) and did the same. Eventually they met in the midde of the island and realised their systems were incompatible. Oops.
A mom and pop video game store used to do the notch thing with the disc cases of games. They would put a line near the bottom of a case with a box cutter