Decisions, decisions

I feel very strongly that the 3-6 month exclusivity window alongside taking down support for games as requested is the best case scenario for everyone. When you publish new game support the work usually reaches a lot of people, and I think most publishers would not move quickly enough to have you remove support before it was free anyway. Like you said, being free doesn’t mean you get a pass, but let’s be honest, publishers aren’t really motivated to touch free software that enhances their games. This could mean a lot more titles are open to you to interact with, and I definitely think paying for early access will keep Patreon revenue strong for you. Overall, I think time gating the mods is the best play for your sanity, income, and to stop the bleeding in general. I’d love if you could completely focus on the next mod knowing you will be paid a fair amount per game before publishing it for free. This would also likely decrease piracy of your work because if a layperson doesn’t know how to do it it’s way easier to just wait or pay rather than steal.

I would like to see a way to get to a free option... for all titles. And lets come up with some real perks for the patreons. Like maybe everyone puts in their system specs so that the options are 100% no config for patreons or people who have exactly their settings? Maybe votes on which games to move to.

4 is my top choice, but I’m very nervous about more DMCA attacks causing Patreon to shut Luke’s profile down completely (even if he swiftly responds to them). Isn’t that what Patreon was threatening Luke with back in January? That even if he complies with the takedown requests, the mere fact that he’s getting so many is grounds for them to terminate his account? If so, then I suppose Option 3 is my next most preferred choice.

Playing KCD2 at moment and it is fantastic, overall looks great with good fps with the exception of some noticble draw distance pop in - I have object quality set to ultra and have tried adding lod config settings to user file to no avail. I was wondering if there was anyone else having same issue. Its not game breaking by any means but breaks immersion a little. I voted 3 but would be happy with anything but 5.

I fear the potential of DMCA-happy publishers not tolerating 2 or 3. I will still vote 2, but in the event the companies are still upset, I would go with 4.

For the love of God guys, option 4 is clearly the superior choice here. Luke gets to earn money and stay dedicated to the development full-time, and games that are on the list will keep getting updates without breaking. Options 1-3 suck, and 5 is just horrible.

Quick question: in November, was version 1.5 of Kingdom Come: Deliverance 2 mod 24.0 or 24.2? Because I kept that version and I want to reinstall it in VR. I kept everything.please my friend

Hi. Can anyone tell me where to write about the problems with launching the mod? Or is there no support at the moment?

Hi Luke. Have you considered the option to open-source the software, in addition to allowing free downloads from Patreon? I apologise if I'm late to the party, I haven't read the other comments. I just thought that you could delegate some workload and responsibility - by making the project Open Source and accepting/filtering pull requests from the public on GitHub or similar - while allowing free downloads of the "official" compiled executables from your Patreon. Enthusiasts will have the ability to help development by fixing bugs and adding support for obscure hardware or niche games, so your workload might decrease in comparison with the increase in development speed and quality of the "mod", and you would still remain the sole beneficiary of donations, as the original founder and maintainer. It's a big step away from full time work on this thing as the single source of income, if it's what it has been. You'll be cutting your income stream by 1:1000, initially. Nothing promises that it would grow back, but on the other hand, it could explode in a way that you alone could never achieve. Most importable, this way you could perhaps ensure that your project stays alive, make it even more active, and some money might still trickle in.

Hi Luke, I've read everything (this post and the previous ones) very carefully. I see that the community isn't interested in closing "the shop" according to the poll, thank goodness. As I always mention, I've been a Patron supporter for years, but lately I've been there one month on, one month off. I don't know if I'll appear as a long-time member, a current member, or if I've driven Patreon crazy, hahaha... Anyway, I would have voted to continue as before (you deserve every last dollar you can get by continuing on Patreon for what you do) and tell those who send you DMCA takedown notices to "go to hell," remove their titles, and move on. I hesitated to vote because I truly believe that in this case, although you can fight them, as you rightly say and as people who know about law have advised you, it's not your fight or your way of doing things. It says a lot about you that you just want to create. You don't need to be a crusader against big companies to be morally right. I completely agree with calling your work a Framework, not a MOD. Definitely, despite losing funding, I would go with option 3. It's true there are no guarantees you won't receive more DMCA takedowns from these guys, but on the other hand, it would make it possible (I suppose) for titles we've been "suggesting" to you for years, like The Witcher 3, to get support, haha. I guess you'd have to somehow send CDPR's lawyers (vultures) what you want to do to see if they "benevolently" withdraw the DMCA takedown. I think that's all. Stay strong, keep your spirits up, and I'm sure you'll make the right decision, which will be good for you and good for a community that will never abandon you. If you're still around, of course :-) Hugs.

How can we get proper REAL VR mod for HITMAN ?

i voted 3, 6 months paywall is good i think. and it's not because cdprojekt and another one dmca'd you that it will repeat again, or anytime soon. this 6 months paywall should be seen as a "beta phase before releasing it free to everyone thing".

I'll still support your work.whatever direction u go.im 59 and with your software I would have never played vr

Can we have a other vote on next game once the dust settles? Is there any way forza gets a look?

I think option 2 makes the most sense as because if people freak about it they would also have to start coming for Team Beef (which I really would hate to see) as this is basically what they do, it seems like a fair solution and the best way forward for you

Two makes the most sense, but since you're still technically charging for the mods, even if only for a month, some cuck lawsuit might still arise. Either way, I know you want your $$$ like anyone else so that's the best way to appease all.

Hi Luke, It’s honestly sad to see this situation happening. No one likes to see tension around a project that brings so much passion and creativity. At the same time, there is something genuinely encouraging about the amount of engagement it has generated. So many people are participating, sharing ideas, debating solutions. It really shows that the community is alive and deeply invested. There are almost as many proposed solutions as there are people contributing, which says a lot about how much this project matters. In a strange way, moments like this also strengthen the mindset and resilience of the person leading the project. Challenges, even uncomfortable ones, tend to sharpen vision and reinforce determination. Whatever direction things take, the level of support and discussion proves that what you built truly matters.

I’m glad to see a 0% vote on “Close up shop”, it would really be a crying shame to see this kind of work come to a complete halt because of legal bullies.

Hi Luke, it's very touching to see that you created a great community that's support you and I'm one of them that love your work. I also have seen what you've done with your framework. It's absolutely amazing. Yes, you took me by storm when I opened up Cyberpunk 2077 for the very first time, my mind was blown I knew this wasn't a mod. That's why I chose to continue supporting you regardless of what the haters are saying, you are R.E.A.L VR. I believe you are going to come out of the storm with a much better outcome. Thank you for letting us participate in voting, I voted 3. Thank you for sharing with us, your talented craft for storytelling. You have giving us a new way of seeing a game in VR, because of your hard work. Please continue doing what you do best. by giving your Subscribers / friends great full service of your Framework. and soon your future subscribers a reason to play R.E.A.L VR, in its whole true form. I do believe whoever plays your creative framework, no matter if they pay for it or receive it for free, they will enjoy the experience that you bring them. I love VR because it takes your mind to another place when you're having a stressful day and you need to unwind with games for entertainment that shows us someone some place or something that's different in the best quality that VR can give you. I know that you will come up with the best solution. Thank you, Luke Ross,

Hi Brandon, please can you share setup instructions for Kingdom Come Deliverance 2. As just picked up this on gamepass and can't access the old post. Many thanks

The main problem you have as always is this platform , setting up your own site and private servers and a private telegram or email based technical support and exchange would fix all of this and ty you will continue making the same money , wish you would consider this over staying here

Hi Luke, I’ve been a long term supporter of both you and preydog on Patreon. Even when I haven’t had time to play much VR. I believe that there is a strong community around VR and people will continue to support the great work you do, even if you make your mod free. Your passion and commitment to VR is obvious as is your frustration with the studios. I stopped gaming altogether until these VR mods started coming out and would not have bought a single blue chip title without them. Hats off to you and Preydog!

Dear Luke Ross, I wish to offer you not only my encouragement, but also a sincere reflection on the extraordinary importance of your work. In moments of difficulty, it is easy for the world to focus on criticism, controversy, or judgment. Many individuals build visibility or profit by attacking others, often without understanding the dedication, sacrifice, and passion that lie behind true innovation. Yet none of this should overshadow the profound impact of what you have created. The gaming industry produces remarkable titles, crafted with immense talent by major studios. However, without individuals like you willing to devote time, intellect, and creativity to expanding what is possible many of these worlds would remain confined to a screen. Through your vision, they become something more: they become alive. They become immersive. They become magical. Since my childhood, when I played on the original PlayStation, I wondered whether it would ever be possible to step inside the games I loved, to inhabit those universes rather than merely observe them. Today, thanks to your talent, your vision, and—if I may say so your brilliant and courageous creativity, that dream has become real. You have achieved what many considered impossible, bringing complex and beloved titles into VR with extraordinary skill. This is not simply technical expertise; it is a form of artistry. It is important to acknowledge that in today’s world, financial stability is essential. Every person strives to live with dignity, support their loved ones, and build a secure future. There is nothing improper in seeking fair compensation for your work, especially when your contributions enrich the experiences of thousands of people. I encourage you to reflect deeply on the unique value you bring to this field. Without pioneers like you, many of the most powerful and iconic titles would never reach their full potential in virtual reality. Your work does not merely modify games it expands the boundaries of what interactive experiences can become. It transforms extraordinary creations into unforgettable worlds. Please continue to trust your instincts, protect yourself from unnecessary risks, and pursue the path that allows your passion to flourish while ensuring your well‑being. Your contributions are rare, meaningful, and deeply appreciated. If I may express a personal sentiment: the world of VR is richer because of you, and many of us sincerely hope you will continue your remarkable journey. With profound respect and gratitude.

People who chose option 2 or 3, please note that after the 3 or 6 months support period, game updates will break VR, and it's good bye. There is no support anymore. Only option 4 guarantees continuous support. EDIT: as Brandon mentioned, it could be that only those games that receive DMCAs won't receive support.

Hi Luke! Option 1 gets everybody out of trouble and happy. Supporters will still support, it will drag even more, and more people will be using the mods giving you a stronger position.

I'm definitely sorry you're going through all of this and that publishers are such dickwads. One thing I want to note, though, is that while you say this isn't your crusade and you don't want to fight, if you do anything other than close up shop, sooner or later, you're going to have to fight to at least some level by filing counter-notices. Otherwise you'll just get booted off Patreon and every other platform by publishers who "shoot first and ask questions later" by filing a DMCA strike against you before even talking to you, and don't care whether your work is free, paid, mod, middleware, or completely and totally unrelated to their game. Counter-notices are the only way you can keep going in those circumstances by forcing them to actually put some substance behind their attacks. Unfortunately, the platform policies and the law as it stands treat non-response to a DMCA notice as a de facto admission of guilt. Taking down the supposedly "infringing" content doesn't prevent them from putting a black mark on your record and booting you off the platform once you've accumulated a trio of them, and the system has been set up so that publishers are free to fire and forget these notices with zero consequences, as often and as much as they like. The most important thing to remember here is that they don't want to go to court any more than you do. In fact, they want it quite a lot less, because an actual court battle stands a very good chance of a precedent that actually establishes that their shrinkwrap agreements are unenforceable and invalid. Their leverage is entirely in intimidation and the pretense that they're prepared to drag this into court and can afford it, while you can't. But you do need to understand that it is a bluff.

"I’m leaning toward Option 1 with a twist. Make it free for everyone, but offer a Pro version for those who donate to support Luke’s work. More support means more features (like motion controls!). Build it, and they will come. Luke’s GTA mod is what got me into VR to begin with. Whatever you decide, thanks for the hard work, Luke. Much love from Texas. — David"

Just a troubleshooting topic. My gaming PC is wanting to upgrade from Windows 10 to Windows 11. Does anybody know of any issues running the newest versions of Windows 11? Games will still run using open XR/steam VR/real VR, etc. even though they took the mixed reality stuff off of the newer Windows 11? I’m running an Apple Vision Pro and using ALVR. I’ve got a brand new gaming PC with a 5090 RTX. ALVR doesn’t support anything other than the legacy VR setting on real VR so that’s what I’m using. Works great currently.

Support you no matter what you choose

I wanted to add my voice to others' suggestion of ja hybrid version between 3 & 4 by ust making a couple of the best DMCA games free with donations. RDR2 and cyberpunk are what you are best known for. They are the advertisement to help promote your business. Keeping them free and functioning will grow your audience, silence most of the haters, and hopefully keep the DMCA notices off your back. I think you will get more business this way and will help the VR community grow. Incidentally, I saw some of the vitriol you have been describing after stumbling on to Beardo Benjee's YouTube video about this. In his defense, he did argue both sides somewhat well despite ultimately landing in the opposition camp in his conclusion. I commented there the contradiction in saying "You can't profit off of someone else's IP" while he is sitting there on youtube profiting off of someone else's IP. There is a lot of bad law and philosophical hypocrisy wrapped up in the DMCA law that most people aren't willing/able to mentally deep dive on. A lot of the bad comments read like jealousy to me at the thought of your success. The hidden evil of good-intentioned socialist philosophies is they encourage jealousy of success, which tends to lead to a race to the bottom where nobody gets to have anything pretty.

Heard about this... and options 2 & 3, if i understand them will both result in the VR version breaking as updates occur, meaning the games will self patch and at some point, very likely start to fail without updates. Option 1, means no $$ to support you which won't work. Which leaves 4 or close shop, 4 makes people NOT like the companies who are strict on DMCA, which means I don't buy their games, i complain to them about their policies, you stay out of trouble and you continue to support the games with out a-holes running those games. Why companies don't want you offering 3d VR to their games at no cost to THEM boggles my mind.

612 votes right now and 0% for closeup shop. Unanimous that would be so depressing

Hey Luke, I didn't want to add much to the suggestions as there have been plenty already. I honestly and earnestly think you should KEEP REALVR AS IS, as I written here before. But just in case there is ABSOLUTELY no other choice but to change, here is an idea: Modify 2/3 and have an unspecified period where (new or not) game conversions are in "early access". They are still being worked on, and not fully complete according to the developer's estimations. These would not be included in the "free" pack, for as long you determine, on an individual basis. Maybe they still need DLSSS implementation, or camera tweaks are still pending, or maybe the game is still actively getting updates, so you would naturally be likely busy updating after patches. Supporting members will receive these "early access profiles" as usual. BUT I still believe you should NOT CHANGE a thing and continue as is. We (the real ones) know the meaning of a capitalist transaction and we like what we pay for. Frequent updates and support, and keeping our postmaester in the roster.

A lot of good suggestions here, and valid perspectives. I chose 4 because 1-3 is a losing proposition for you financially; I see you giving up after a few months because your past standard of living can no longer be met. As one of those who contributes to Praydog, I do so because of his consistent output, which is why I contribute to you. If it were possible, I would love if it the Cyberpunk mod could be locked behind a paywall where you would have to contribute to a developer's preferred charity to get access to it.

Make it freely available. The support won’t fall off and in the meantime, more people will add critical mass which could make a difference eventually

Greetings ! I was thinking of option 6: DMCA : Free release separate and autonomous RVR RDR2 and RVR Cyberpunk optimised versions with all the best to date (AER2... ) Open donations and subscription to support developing the VR framework technology and its "compatibility" with new games. Profiles for specific games are separate download and are free.(Considering this framework is not a mod but a driver for new peripherals to interface with games) Pros: use the DMCA titles as a demonstration and proof of concept for masses to appeal to the AAA VR experience. Grow VR player base and demand for more AAA conversions.... and creation... Here is something I can't say enough: RDR2 is the finest AAA VR experience of all time and it could hold a steady 90fps at crazy resolution / max settings with rtx4090 if AER2 could be implemented. Cons: ... ??? 🤔...you tell me.

Another option may be to have the free side be time limited like trialware? So anyone can use the mod for free, but it only works for one hour a day. If you want unlocked use, you have to enter a key. Also, for gods sake can’t NVidia, Meta or Steam get interested in sponsoring and backing your work? So you’re not fighting this alone? You have personally sold more RTX5090s, 80s and 70s than any of their advertising, (even a sponsor link from them with a percentage to you?) and VR PC gaming was on life support without your work and other flat2VR efforts, so meta and steam owe you a big one too. The last official AAA titles were ages ago, and publishers won’t waste time on them anymore. (Fallout and Skyrim vr)

My advice is have the VR framework separate from the new games settings. And I would say give the new games settings for free but charge a subscription just for the framework. And move the new games to your own website not Patreon or perhaps a diferent platform for payment. If it’s your website they can’t force you to take down anything. And as many users have also said: I will continue to support no matter what option you choose.

I will keep supporting you Luke, no matter which optio it will be. Thank you for your extraordinary work so far, letting us enjoy our favorite games in the VR 👏🏼

Just want to say I will continue to support no matter the option taken. Luke and Brandon have been fantastic and I hope the Pateron goes on in some form. Ps I chose option 2 because it seemed the one to keep both sides of companies and haters happy ( if thats possible)..

I still support the cause, don't stop.

Should allow us to vote for more than one choice as we will support you regardless except option 5.

Polls are great and all but make sure the decision reflects your best interests. You've contributed a great deal to the VR community. Make sure it's what's best for you.

Regardless, unless option 5 is chosen, I will continue to contribute and support. I'm just wondering though, if you do go with any of the first 4 option, will CP2077 support return, in any form? Say..... Restored compatibility that isn't documented in release notes?

If it were free: Is there no option to support DMCA'd games in any way? Is it out of spite or compliance? For some reason I want the DMCA-proof path.

I was just thinking about the 2 and 3 options. If there won't be any updates after the 3 or 6 moths period and the game update breaks VR, some entitled freeloaders will still be mad and demand "justice", or punishment for Luke, if he doesn't deliver the fix for free. Sooner or later these VR breaking updates will come, so it's only a matter of time until the hate is unleashed. I personally voted 4, but I admit there is a higher risk of permanent ban of the Patreon account with this option. So I would change my vote for the 6 months option, which is IMO the best compromise, and the game could get support for VR breaking updates for longer. Some games never stop updating even years after release. 3 months seems not enough for a game to settle down after the initial release.

I never saw this as paying for games, or software, or mods. I have always seen this as supporting incredible work, done by an amazing person. I appreciate your perspective, humor, and creations. I love the game Cyberpunk 2077, but would not still be playing it if it wasn't for your framework. Your work makes games worth playing. I feel so strongly about what is fair and what is earned, that I would boycott my favorite game companies to do what's right and stand behind you. I hope you follow your heart in this heavy decision. I will continue to support and stand behind you regardless of what you choose.

which is the option which would allow us to get titles like Dead Space and Hitman in proper VR with headaim and controller ? I opt for that. But yeah if feels a 6th option is needed somewhat a mix of 4 and a DMCA free sale of framework for other titles.

I also agree with those saying "option 6", the licensed commercial software injector option with retail purchase is a proven and viable option that goes farther to avoid conflict

Je finance votre travaille depuis plusieurs années, même si je joue beaucoup moins à la VR. Tout travaille mérite salaire, surtout ce niveau d'expertise nous permettant d'utiliser nos jeux en VR. La Solution 3 me semble la plus pertinente.

Option 4 - keep them coming!

Thanks for including us in all your "stages of grief" here and know we are glad you made it out the other side. The poll is great but in the end, do what makes you happiest as that is what will keep you making these odd engine games available to us in VR. If one game was easy to add and you want to use it to get more people hooked/exposed? Give it away faster. One game was a massive pain in the rear and you only kept it going because you knew a bunch of us (or yourself) were going to love it, keep that one locked up for longer. Reasonable people will pay for something when the value of the offer seems worth the cost. The others? You will never completely escape the pirates/freeloaders/haters so hopefully like I started with, you are already doing what makes you happy. If you feel good about your work, your value proposition, and your offerings to the VR world then your people will find you.

Hi there. I wanted to say thank you. I'm sure I speak for a lot of people when I say that your VR software (not Mod) has been one of the things that has kept me interested in VR, and on the occasion I've had an issue Brandon has been amazing. I'm almost 50, and have been gaming since consoles had the power of calculators. Being sat in the world of Cyperpunk (and others) in VR is, I think, the best gaming experience I've ever had. I really hope you find a way through this. Thanks again.

As a retired systems engineer I understand the effort involved in coding(from a general overview, never coded gaming code). That's why I chose option 2. I think your effort deserves some compensation and will pay for those efforts for your upgrades.

As of right now, several of the options are neck-and-neck. I expect it's a hard decision for most of us since we're not lawyers, and this is a legal problem. So I second the advice to see an IP lawyer. They should be able to advise which of these options is the best and safest.

I guess there could be the option of having your software be paywalled but having the configurations available for free (free but useless). Tougher to maintain that, however.

Hi Luke, i have voted for Option 3 (6 months Early Access), as I believe it's the best compromise between financial sustainability and reducing DMCA risk. But while thinking through the options, an alternative came to mind that might be worth considering – call it "Option 6": You mention VorpX yourself – and I keep wondering why you haven't considered going in a similar direction. VorpX sells their framework as standalone commercial software, with a one-time purchase, no Patreon, no "paywalled mod" controversy – and nobody attacks them. A possible combination: • Kickstarter to bridge the financing during the transition • One-time purchase for the R.E.A.L. VR Framework (~$50, similar to VorpX) • Optional annual update subscription for new or broken games / continued development ~15 -25$ (one, two or three years)... • Game-specific modules free after 6 months – takes the DMCA pressure off This would position R.E.A.L. VR clearly as what it actually is: professional commercial software – not a "paywalled mod". Legally cleaner, financially more sustainable, and no platform can pull the plug on you again. Thank you for everything you do for the VR community! I've been buying games for years because of your work. 👍 Good luck my friend! All the best! 🙏 johno

Option 4. Restructure, carry on. What you made is really great and has value. The skill and effort that it takes to build something that works as well as realvr is not to be underestimated. The continued work that you will put in has value. And the price tag is low if you just want to subscribe for one month to get the current version then unsubscribe and use it as long as you want. And just resubscribe when there is an update that you want, or stay subscribed and support your work to the fullest. Its up to the individual what they want to get how much they want to support. Ignore the haters and ignorant jerks. Despite how some are trying to frame it, the DMCA notices are not your fault, you don't deserve the criticisms over that.

3 for me. I really appreciate the time and effort that goes into bringing new games to the party whilst supporting all the updates on the ever increasing portfolio. I also like UEVR with a big part of that being controller support, so whilst I appreciate everything you do my priority would be slightly different with less supported games but with more controller support. That said I am fully aware of your previous comments on this subject but felt it important to say.

I voted for 6 month paid. Preydog’s Patreon donations are abysmal. If you don’t get paid there won’t be an incentive to continue. Every time the game breaks due to an update keep that behind the pay wall for 6 months as well. Give the general public a taste but not the whole thing. I get paid to work, why shouldn’t you? Glad you started to see beyond the fog. VR needs you.

I’m in favor of 1 or 2. Some people complain about you charging money but you’re filling a gap no one else wanted too. Cyberpunk was one of my favorite games to play in vr so thank you for that however this shakes out

I am one of the 342 UEVR supporters, it is obvious to me that if I use something a lot, I don't regret supporting it, since it made it possible. I voted for 3.

the problem is that the more games work on the framework, the more ross has to fix stuff whenever there are updates, it becomes too much for one guy unless he starts hiring devs (which isn’t easy cause the tech is so specialized) maybe if stuff gets “free” after 3 months he’ll be able to say that fixing after updatescis no longer a priority… which would be a shame for the supporters

Thank you for making this post and giving your supporters a voice in how you move forward. No matter how the voting turns out, I am extremely happy that you will be continuing as your mods have been one of the main things keeping me in my VR headsets over the past few years. I say you will be continuing because I can guarantee that there will be 0 votes for you to close shop. That would be ludicrous!! I voted for option 3 because that would give you a good amount of time to get patreon support from those who want to support you so that you can keep doing this full time. Those who don't think what you do is worth paying for would just have to wait half a year if time isn't important to them. Please for your own sanity try to ignore the VOCAL minority who bring out the pitchforks. The only people you should focus your energy on are the ones who support you. Let the others kick rocks, and keep doing what you do!

First of all, thank you very much for allowing us to have a vote, regardless of it playing a big role in the decision or not! As one of those 342 people paying Praydog monthly simply to support the hard work, you can count on me supporting you too if you go free. However I understand that I'm the minority and I'd much prefer you to have a model that could be a compromise to solve the situation, but still would provide you with enough income to be interested in continuing. Initially I thought screw it, let's just make it free and maybe just add some other goodies on top that people would need to pay for (like voting for the next game, get support, or even extra features like DLSS support as some suggest here). But if these 5 options are the only ones, I want something that would clearly increase the subs count. So I voted for option 2. I think it's a good amount of time to push some hotfixes for the new game, let the subscribers enjoy the early access, but also not as long as half of a year. In the end, even if you make it a year, the game can get broken after that anyway. I hope that if that happens, you could address it and publish the fix in the same way as a new game support - so if you want the fix sooner than 3 months from now (and by now I mean whenever you address it, not ASAP) you need to subscribe. Sure it's a bit trickier than the current model, but I think it really adds freedom to how you could treat each DMCA situation. Someone also mentioned the possibility of an API for the mod, so that others could make it compatible to other games instead. I think this could still be an option regardless of the subscription model, although that might mean you'd need to explicitly forbid using the API for the titles that you want to support yourself. So maybe a whitelisted API or something like that. I for one would definitely dive into it to make my dream come true and make Yakuza series work in VR. Ishin worked great with UEVR, I finished it the whole way in VR, but that was the only game in Unreal engine they made. For others they use Dragon engine and in my attempts I failed to find much documentation on the engine. Knowing very little about OpenXR and VR injection in general and having experience mostly as a web developer I kinda give up on this idea so far (apart from using Reshade for SBS, but it doesn't work that well for me). But if we'd have the API and so I could at least cut corners that way, oh boy would I love to try. Also, I strongly believe a cooperation with Valve/Steam could be very beneficial for everyone. I hope you would at least keep such opportunities on your radar. Whatever you decide, you have my eternal love for the work that you have already done. VR is one of the few joys I have left in life and being able to play all these titles that way really makes me happy. So ignore the trolls and always know that your work matters a lot and is very appreciated! <3

If you not here and work for VR we have no the cool AAA title IN VR. YOU GET MY SUPPORT. I AM 67 YEARS OLD and 4070 nvidia. It runs !

I fully respect that this decision belongs to the community, but I was curious to know which option feels best to you personally as the creator.

I've carefully read your post (thank you for it) and quite a few comments. I've been hesitating between options 3 and 4, and finally voted for 3. The catch I see with option 4 is that official release supporting a game with DMCA takedown (like cyberpunk( would disappear. To me, option 4 where you keep working on games without takedowns and make free those with takedowns would be good but wouldn't protect you over time if more studios follow the same past as PCR. Option 1 is fine with me but I do appreciate it woudl mean you having a different source of income and much less dedication to Real VR, which would be a pity. People have suggested a more sustainable, paid model like VorpX. Isn't that worth exploring? Anyway, anything but option 5:) I'll still support you on/off, as I've done until now. Take care of yourself and I hope you make the right choice. P.S.: I see the changes you mentioned at the beginning, which you'll implement anyway, in terms of rebranding and changing of a few names, very positive and necessary.

I opted for option 3. Though, you're the expert, what would you (Like and Brandon) recommend as the best solution for you and us enthusiast users?

Long time supporter. Occasional poster. You have put a lot of your time, blood, sweat and tears into this. The VR environment is all the better for it. Whatever your decision, I will respect it. You deserve to make a living from this , like any other artist. best of luck. I notice that you are dialoguing with Pimax right now. maybe someone at Valve might also be worth a chat with. Best. J

I’ve always felt good about supporting this. I’ve never had an issue paying — the value is absolutely there for me, especially with Cyberpunk. What matters most to me is continued development and solid updates. I’d honestly hate to see this shut down — Option 5 would feel like a real loss. I’ve never really understood the “everything must be free” argument. In the real world, time and skill have value, and what you’ve built is serious work. Supporting that just makes sense to me. From a player’s perspective, I also struggle to see how something that gets more people playing and loving a game is a negative. It feels like it adds value, not takes away from it. Part of me would love to see you stand your ground and show that independent creators can’t just be pushed around. But more than anything, I want you to choose the path that protects you long term. And honestly — you should step back and realise how important you are in this space. You’re a rockstar here. For a lot of us, you are VR . That carries weight, good and bad — but it also means this is bigger than it might feel right now. Whatever you decide, there are plenty of us who genuinely appreciate what you’ve built and are happy to support it.

I haven't commented here for along time but I want to say I'm really sorry all this has happened to luke and all of us it's a damn shame and it would be really depressing to lose all the hard work he has put in to this if it werent for Luke's conversions I probably wouldn't be putting on my headset very often although life has afforded me little time to play all the games I have stayed a subscriber since the days when we only had rdr2. I would say all the hate is just unfortunately human nature and people just don't understand the work that goes into all this. I know its hard but try not pay attention to it words can be powerful and your mind gives whatever meanind or validity to them you allow. I tried voting but not sure if it worked correctly. I picked 2 but 2 3 and 4 are OK anything but 5. It may not be feasibly possible but I would like to have two different versions of the "Framework" one the early access version that operates under the options luke set out for each and another version perhaps called Classic that would have the removed mods from the past like rdr2 and mafia and its probably wishful thinking and it would be extra work that luke would have to do but I would love to see some of those games updated to use the new optimisations luke has worked his magic to create. Even if it was something that was worked on slowly I wouldnt care Lol. And also maybe once In a while a conversion that luke has found quite easy to convert could be added to the classic version as a gift to the vr community even if some are unappreciative. I know luke may never do conversions of games for companies that have sent him dmca letters but my dream games would be GTA IV and Bioshock. Ultimately I hope it all works out and we keep getting to experience these amazing worlds I have still only dipped my toes into half the games because as people already know you can get lost looking at all the things you would never see in 2d. That's what the game publishers and developers don't seem to understand is their players get to appreciate the finer details of the hard work that went into creating the game when its in VR.

I like the open source model system better, but you're right, with such a vast OS ecosystem, it's not well financed, at all. For the options 2 and 3, i would have done it a bit differently : stable version for free, and new features / games / optimizations for available the paying subscribers.

I also think you should add a 6th option like Cla3008 and a few others have already mentioned ( the VORPX route is the better option to continue to make good money and be protected the SOFTWARE would be at a higher tier for one time payment , at ((20 or 30 )), it has some functionality like desktop view , and requires sign up and key to prove you supported , and stop piracy , and has zero connection to games , for games put the file that enable game function on other sites for free , also add a (( 5 or 10 )) dollar tier for software updates )

I'd go with option 4. Protect yourself legally while providing support for titles where the developers / publishers can use their brains to see that your RealVR framework is actually bringing them more sales. I would also continue to liaise with CDPR but only while it's kept friendly or at least professional. Make them aware of the fact that a legal copyright expert has given you a very detailed brief on how you would win should you decide to fight back. But as an individual you don't want to do that (which I completely understand and agree with). If you can make a living without CP2077, then do that. It's something you love doing and I can't imagine you'd be happy doing another job after RealVR. Whatever you decide, good luck and thanks for all the fish :-)

Hey Luke, glad you did not decide to close up shop! I appreciate you wanted to include us in the decision (well, the only morally/philosophically correct action is that you decide for yourself, of course, which you probably plan to do anyway) but people being people .... I see that even option 5 got a few hits! I think you should have decided to go on as before (option 4) by default and see how it goes for a few months. To me, any other option would suggest that you are giving in to the corporate bullies or to the vocal morons that cannot even create a simple Excel formula, much less mod VR into a modern game (most of the haters don't use VR, and those that do are probably pissed off they cannot just pay once, or ask their cousin for the file, and use a pirated game version). Also, options 2-3 are not even feasible, seeing how often many games are updated, unless you consider any game VR broken by an update as a "new" game. And even so, how are you going to prioritise between a game that needs an updated mod versus new games you/people want to play. Whatever you decide, I'll keep supporting you. Thank you very much for providing some of the best gaming experiences I've ever had!

Your choice. You get my $10 per month regardless. Fuck anyone that gets upset - it's $10. Ain't shit.

4. Remove the banned titles Is there an option to provide the banned versions for free? Personally my gaming rig is just about good enough for CP2077, but newer games are unplayable. I haven’t dipped into the back catalogue of games yet that my 3070 equipped laptop will likely play brilliantly on n VR. Far Cry and others. Seeing as I reckon most people signed up for CP2077, that’s going to be your gateway product, provide that for free and move to a licensed framework for new titles. I’d like to see more older games in the catalogue. FWIW, I don’t see you as some sort of parasite, I can’t understand the mentality of those people unless it’s just a social media echo chamber of entitled young adults who want everything for free and ultimately resort to piracy anyway. Whatever you decide I’ll continue to support you monetarily as long as I can access your software enhancement. I believe that is a fair deal, I cannot imagine the level of effort that goes into development, testing and investment in equipment to ensure your enhancement software works across different hardware stacks. I hope you choose to keep going.

Hey, make a framework, and allow extra support/optimization for specific game to be scriptable mod to your program. Get "contributor" to do these support as open-source project. In fact be extra great to open up API to your framework such it becomes a MOD within Cyberpunk access to achieve VR, they can go send DMCA takedown to their own modding community, good luck.

Sincerily I dont know what is the best...me I'll continued to supporting you.

Luke, I can't vote for any of the options. Because you missed the option to go full in the vorpx/big screen/whatever route, If it's possible.

I've only been a paying subscriber for 1 month and the others I have had for free so I'm not sure how much of a say I should get, but I have voted. I genuinely appreciate the hours of content of I've had from your hard work and I would gladly continue paying either way. That's why I went with option 4. It makes sense if we're paying, to get the best possible product with the most possible updates - and I legit think you've got the best / easiest to install / easiest to use / most updated product on the market. If any more games get taken in this way in the future, then I would reconsider again but for now, I would consider yourself and your finances first. Especially with how unkind the internet has been, I think it's very good of you to still allow your community to have a say as well. I hope you continue - you're a credit to developers.

I voted despite that the best option wasn't there: VorpX / UEVR style injector that doesn't touch game directory. Have some generic VR functionality that makes your "app" usable even without a game specific part. Maybe even allow community created "profiles".

Option 4 for me. All that options 2 & 3 do is placate the so called 'VR community' and still doesn't really stop a future dmca. BUT if it's option 1, 2 or 3, I will still stay as part of your patreon. Luke, maybe move away from patreon to a different site due to the three strikes and out rule? Anyway, please do not stop you're amazing work.

I like options 2 and 3. Even before R* DMCA attack, i was keen for this option, because a Patreon doesn't buy art, a R.E.A.L. Patreon pays for making art available for everyone, even very poor people ;) We have yet to see how many people stays in the patreon, and if it's economically viable, but it's worth to try it. I hate option 5, even if you release the source code, this has been a very nice trip, and I wouldn't like to end it like this. We deserve a better ending, like "most AAA have native VR support", or "My kids demand me a lot of time and my life will go in another direction".

I just wanted to send you a message of support during this important moment. Whatever direction you ultimately choose, I sincerely hope you continue. What you’ve built over the years is unique. For many of us, R.E.A.L. VR is not just a technical tool, it’s what makes modern AAA games truly immersive and unforgettable. It’s easy for people on the outside to criticize, but those of us who actually use your work understand the level of expertise, dedication, and time it requires. High-quality VR conversions at this level don’t happen by accident. They require focus and financial stability. I respect that you don’t want to fight legal battles and that you prefer building rather than arguing. That mindset is exactly why your work stands out. Please know that there are many serious VR users who value what you do and want you to continue, in whatever sustainable model allows you to keep creating without burning out. Thank you for everything you’ve made possible so far.

I voted for option 2. But it neefs to be your own desicion. I will continue to support for as long as i can afford it regardless. Sorry i did not have time to read the entire blog.

option 4. luke stop worrying about the negative comments, their all from people who dont even play VR anyways. i've been subscribed to you for years and how dare these assholes try to tell me how and where to spend my money. don't stop, and if you get a dmca notice then drop the game and move on.

the VORPX route is the better option to continoue to make good money and be protected the SOFTWARE would be at a higher tier for one time payment , at ((20 or 30 )), it has some functionality like desktop view , and requires sign up and key to prove you supported , and stop piracy , and has zero connection to games , for games put the file that enable game function on other sites for free , also add a (( 5 or 10 )) dollar tier for software updates

Luke, don't stop doing what you love, I'm 58, had jobs i hated for years, feels like a wasted life, your VR work put me inside Hogwarts castle, it was a wonderful moment, keep up the excellent work, shame there couldn't be a way to make the free download not work unless you buy a key of some kind lol. Mark

2 and 3 wont really protect you , you already got 3 dmca attacks and a ton of people know you including companies , since you like giving interviews and attracting more attention on you , the trolls most likely will report when you open shop , the VORPX route remains the only real way , and a rebrand

Luke Be patient . Make the right choice. We are supporting you!

I think the second option would be somewhat fair to you, and keep the tip jar open. My only suggestion, if i read this right is, to keep the games up to date when the companies do updates that break the mod. Of course at your earliest convience, seeing the revenue wont be the same, meaning you cannot just focus on the updates. We all appreciate your efforts, regardless of yhe vile comments you gave read. I know i bought several games on steam i woukd never have because if your not mod, LOL.

Not 5! Just please not 5... EVER! Long live Luke Ross!

This may be an option you have considered and ruled out, but if there are no hidden gotchas, would seem to address the problem with out really changing much. What if the framework was free to all, but subscribers were entitled to early access (say about 6-9 months early) for new releases, fixes, enhancements and repairs to accommodate new releases of supported games? For my part I'm a subscriber even if everything is free, so I forfeit my vote. But I'd be far happier if there was a way to keep you whole and not having to deal with the Corpos or their lawyers.

I think you are the only guy who can do this for us all, I would make it free for everyone and ask for a suggested donation?. Being you are that dude, hopefully folks will support you without ties to any game titles, just the REALVR mod. Sorry this kind of shit permeates our already small and meek VR community. -GrooveGoblinVR

The correct answer is for Valve to incorporate your mod into Steam, pay you and others to add more games, and they can negotiate with the publishers as to whether or not their game is included. The Steam Frame will be “modifying” all VR games with foveated streaming, how is your framework any different. Keep up the good work mate, don’t give in to the hate.

CDPR are obviously not going to get any sales increase by behaving so stupidly. Their crappy attitude is not a good marketing ploy for future releases either. (Option 4 for me).

I don't like any of those options. I don't see how option 2/3 would be much different than what you are doing now, considering the problematic games are ones that would probably be constantly new for a few years, due to continual updates, and fall within the 3 or 6 month window. What about another option to keep this membership going and you paid for your hard work? Make your software a vr conversion engine/app/studio where you or anyone can provide and load and create vr profiles for games, and also allow others in the community create profiles for other games using your engine. Open the community to sharing profiles created for games. Make that part free. You'd still have to write fixes for certain games, which only subscribers would get, but you could include those fixes/updates for games that require it without even mentioning the name of the game at all in the software release. Label the fixes generically. If the fix involves a new setting that might need to be on or off, or have more a drop down to select between 4 different options in a profile - still label it generically. What's new in release notes could say "VR rendering mode fixes for instability with some DX12 titles" or "Added Raytracing support for DX11 titles" instead of even mentioning a name. Essentially - charge for the engine/studio(framework as you were calling it but in a interface/app package/install). Release fixes with generic labels and config option names - never mention any specific game title or company.

Another variation of #1 I think I mentioned before is, what about everything is free (avoiding dmca) but FEATURES such as dlss support, or aesv2 are paid subs only? Virtually everyone wants those features and will pay for them, but the games are entirely playable as a free mod/application

Ill go with 2 or 3 as long the price remains the same. I'm guessing the average subscriber here re-subscribes 2 or 3 times a year to update? So 20 to 30 usd per year. I'm happy to pay a bit more than that per year (I subscribed a full year before), but for others they may not want to or be able to pay more than the equivalent of a decent game per year

I'm really just gonna echo what a lot of peeps have said in the comments already: while I deeply appreciate your openness with the community and sharing your thought process, I fundamentally do not feel that I (or anyone else for that matter) really deserves any input in this matter. Regardless of which option you choose, the biggest impact (positive and negative) will be on you - whether financial, emotional, etc. Ultimately, there is nobody who is equipped to weigh these factors and decide what you are willing to live with and what you want from your life than you. As someone who has loved and enjoyed your work for years, I bear zero ill will towards you if you choose option 5. Imho a lot of the people telling you to just "ignore the haters" have not been on the receiving end of this level of sustained hate and emotional pressure before, bc they are significantly underestimating how (1) hard to impossible it is to ignore this level of hate and how draining it is, and (2) how consistently being exposed to it can turn doing something you love into something you loathe, which would be a doubly horrible outcome. I really hope you treat this poll as one of many inputs into the choice you ultimately make, because you should not let the bad actors (whether CDPR or the hate mob) effectively force you into a decision that you would not otherwise have made. To the degree that you care about our opinions as supporters of yours - I voted 4 - imho it is the only option that does not fundamentally compromise the value of your work just to appease people you don't owe any appeasement to. We know what the statistics on donation-only projects look like (nobody donates), so option 1 basically means the end of what you've created anyway. 2 and 3 are just different variations of acquiescing to bad faith actors. As you've astutely pointed out, the legal basis for these DMCA notices is extremely shaky, and in an ideal world I'd love to see you serve counter-notices and ultimately prevail in court. But here in the real world, the power imbalance is so massive that it would be ruinous to you regardless of outcome. You would be spending the next 5 years of your life dealing with legal matters instead of doing the actual work you're passionate about. TL;DR: prioritise your (mental and physical) health, get some real independent legal advice from a lawyer actually working for you (even if it costs a couple of grand, and I don't mean for that to sound so glib - it is worth the investment while you consider your options, because in the end you're the one who is going to be affected most by what happens going fwd), reflect on the input of your community as this is clearly important to you, and then make a decision based on what YOU want to do, and most importantly, can live with when you look in the mirror in the morning. Chin up :)

A major game update breaking a fix should also cause the game to be reclassified as new. Cyberpunk is a great example where game updates created a LOT of additional work for Luke Ross, especially the 2.0 update...

I like options 2 and 3 but please implement some credentials checking, maybe by making RVR a program we run that we can point to the supported games instead of manually dragging in the files and running the .bat that way we don't have to give Patreon credentials for every game and can just sign in once and have it check that you're an active member when it's injecting the files. This keeps the current behavior where if you subscribe for a month and install the VR framework on a game you can keep playing it even if you unsub (not something I'd do since I'm a years long supporter) since the RVR tool would be where authorization takes place not the VR rendering itself

#3 is the best option imo. It satisifies the most people and counters dmca-attacks.

I like option 2 or 3 honestly don't mind financially supporting someone who puts this amount ofeffort into vr.

I honestly think options 2 or 3 (early access, then free later) make the most sense long term, and not just as a legal compromise but as a growth strategy. One thing I feel is missing from the discussion is how people actually discover your work. The Baldur’s Gate 3 release is a perfect example. I had been hoping for a BG3 VR solution for years and only learned it existed because I’m already subscribed. If I wasn’t, that would have been an instant resub moment for me. Right now a lot of huge releases only reach people who are already inside the Patreon, while potential new users never even realize something they want already exists. VR is very different from normal mods because videos don’t fully sell the experience. You can watch 10 videos saying Cyberpunk VR is the greatest experience ever (and I absolutely agree), but at some point you still have to trust creators and buy in blind. People really need to try it once. Having older versions become free after some time could work as a “proof of concept”. Someone tries VR in an older supported game, realizes how good it feels, and then gladly pays to get immediate access when a new big title drops instead of waiting months. Not the best example, but if VR Doom releases existed before Dark Ages came out, and I wasn’t sub alreadt, I would have resubbed immediately just to play it. Also, piracy probably doesn’t change much regardless of the model. One person can already subscribe for a month and redistribute files. That reality exists today, and those people likely won’t ever buy anyway. If anything, there might even be some conversion from people wanting access right away before a pirated version spreads, especially after seeing the quality of the work. Kind of like people re-buying games they pirated as kids, either for convenience or as a token of appreciation. What actually converts people into paying supporters is convenience, updates, and trust in you as a creator, not file control. (2 examples in my personal life would be pirating Far Cry 3, playing for 2 hours and ordering it same day, or learning pirated adobe software as teen, and then paying for years as Creative Cloud user). Personally I think a little more transparency about experiments or games you are looking into, without promises or deadlines, would also build healthy anticipation. Even “I’m testing X engine, no guarantees” creates excitement and gives people a reason to follow and support development. Whatever direction you choose, many of us are here because of the framework itself and the work you’ve built over years, not just individual releases.

Just remove the titles with DCMA strikes, like you did with Take Two. Your time is valuable. There are plenty of games to play with Real VR, and not all publishers are DCMA-trigger-happy.

Classic poetic LR with the sweet choose your own adventure poll. The legit greatest - people's champ 😎

Like I said.i paid almost two years and didnt get what was initially promised. Make it free you probably made a ton allready

I voted for option 4. You have my support in whichever direction this goes

I think options 2 & 3 are the way to go. The key isn't that it's paid for 3 or 6 months. Instead, it's in beta test during this time until it's released for free. Patreon subscribers can beta test these pre-release versions before they go live for the public. IN this sense, all mods are always free. I'd also say you need to beta test when a game updates and the mod needs a update. This model has worked well for teknoparrot.

I voted #3 because I feel like that gives the best balance between giving you as much as possible while hopefully also satisfying the DMCA issues. However, I would also absolutely be ok with #4 if that's what is needed for you to remain full time doing this and not have to get another job.

I’ll keep supporting you because you make the best VR mod. It’s the only one that works with 4K headsets like Pimax. UEVR is a slideshow at 4K resolution. I would still love to see a Luke Ross / Pimax collab. The future of VR is PCVR and VR enthusiasts that are actually willing to spend money on VR mods.

I'm new here, but I have been a part of the PC and VR community for many years. I think what separates you from "modders" is that they want to add features to the base game – clothing (or lack thereof), weapons, textures, maps, etc. – you're not doing any of that. You're providing a *perspective* games were previously unable or unwilling to provide. All this does is provide a way to expand the player base, keeping the games current and providing additional revenue to the publishing companies, and if they don't understand that, shame on them. And , if you are doing this full-time and providing a service people want, you should be compensated for your efforts, if not by the publishers then by users supporting you through Patreon. It's tough to choose an option, though. I would want to have the ability to play the DMCA-happy publishers' games, but also have you compensated. I suggest making those games free now and continue with the current model.

Good that we have a chance to vote, but it should be Luke's decision. Still, 4 is the best choice, folks. Full time VR conversion, else the cadence of games could be significantly diminished. 1 game every 8 months and considerably less updates.

Keep working on solutions. If these are really the only options I would support you on 4, but the community is understandably bloodthirsty for vr cp2077, which is why 4 isn't getting heavy support. Obviously, I don't know what your current subscription data looks like, but I would bargain you get regular surges in updating months anyway. I think the 3-month is the best bet to test the waters. If that is ok then maybe roll to 6-months so you can push subscriptions via impatience. Certainly add credentials to early access stuff. It's cost-analysis you need to do. Data of interest include your current subscription patterns - What proportion of your income comes directly after updates in games? What proportion of subscribers are 12 mo+? [Maybe this group can be relied on to maintain subscriptions.] What exactly is the subscription lift around game updates on avg and per game? Around cp2077 in particular? Then what proportion of subscriptions do you expect to lose that will wait til its free (poll that and double it!!)? One note of interest is, updates can be pretty frequent, if a game updates every 3-6 months can you force people's hands to just subscribe? So how frequent are ~~mod~~ framework breaking updates among your top 5 most popular games (defined by subscription lift stat?) I'm also curious how many people are pirating. Are you missing out en masse rn? Are they up anywhere you can track downloads? If you can recover money that'd be cool. Ultimately, the point is I, and many of us, support _you_. Whatever you have to do to resist being a corpo fuck like me is what you should do.

Option 2 & 3 seem like the proven model for this, ain't nobody hating on team Beef worth taking seriously. This would mean that there would always be a free option available for your older work for games that are more stable and require less updates. For those of us who would want access to the latest & fixes for breaking patches which are so common for these modern titles, those options support that well. And tbh this also feels like it would still retain most of your audience.

1 but with a delay. Let paying patrons that have 'development access' when 'testing new games' which become free 'when stable' . If a game gets an update that requires a VR update, you need to be in the higher tiers to get the immediate access. What ever the the time delay is don't advertise it because publishers will still think it's a paywalled mod, this is a more reasonable and understandable reason. I'm going to keep paying regardless and I only want to play CP2077 and FF7

Someone mis-clicked option 5. DMCA that post! :-)

Voting 3, but I think it's a mistake to discount the "paid core / free plugins" solution. It's not correct to say that RealVR implements this currently. RealVR64.dll does include game specific code, and the overall package bundles game specific scripts. There's no guarantee that it merely being free removes all legal issues either. That was already proved by Rockstar. I get that there's the legal concept of 'contributary infringement' but if you host with a company less DCMA happy than Patreon, there is a bar needs to be met to show that the "infringing IP" contains the "claimants IP". You could still do option (3) but with the added protection of some separation between "legally questionable code" and "clean" code. There's a reason Vorpx hasn't been dragged into this and it's mostly because they're (1) hosting themselves (2) using a commercial payment provider with a higher bar for DCMA takedowns (3) don't bundle anything game specific.

I am impressed if this has been making your living, without the need to have another job. I can't imagine a scenario this doesn't force you to find an alternative income though. For that reason it has to be your choice and I don't think you can take the result of this survey too literally. Unless you find a way to do this officially, maybe via a porting studio? But anyway, I voted for 3 because I think you should get as much money to make the VR as good as it can be for the players that jump on the latest games while they're still premium priced... while allowing bargain hunters to get the software later. Although I think if that option means no more support when a game update breaks it then, what can be done then?

I do kinda wish you had the ability to fight the corps in court. Even if you lost it would make how far each sides rights go more clearly and set a precedent. I'm aware this is completely unrealistic option unless some benevolent millionair/billionaire decides to throw money at you, but one can dream.

I think that you should be paid for you're hard work. I chose 4. Carry on what your doing and the few studios that dmca you just make those mods free and you are still making more money at the end of the day. Love your work. Don't listen to the idiots that think you should work for free.

Hey! I've "bought" your mod collection two or three times (that's how I see it), and then finally subscribed three or four months ago, but I've always found it way too expensive considering the repeated purchases, which aren't cheap—even more expensive than PlayStation Plus or Ubisoft Plus! I personally think it's immoral to make money off the backs of developers. Yes, I know you explain that it's primarily a tool, but for the average user, it's still just a mod collection for the chance to play AAA titles in VR. Actually, I'm a big fan of UEVR, which is also a fantastic tool and is completely free. In short, I gave it a 1 to give everyone a chance to appreciate your work. I think the cost of your subscription is the problem because while I agree that all work deserves payment, I think you are being too greedy (it would be better if the price were divided by 2 or 3, in order to cover the costs without giving the impression of getting rich) and I fully understand that this is frowned upon for what is supposed to be a passion that we just want to share freely TO PLEASE others, like UEVR which I love, which is also a tool.

I tell ya; I unfortunately expect that GTA6 VR mods by anybody will get immediately struck down, but at the very least CDPR's stance is "Just no paid mods," so with all of the first 3 options, we'd still get Cyberpunk 2 (and maybe Witcher 4) in VR when it comes out, and that's really what I care about more than anything. Also, I've been looking at some of the reactions blasting this Patreon's subscription method and it's just -baffling- to me why anybody could have strong feels about it, let alone get that enraged about it. I think a lot of it comes from the POV of "All my mods should be free," without taking into consideration "being paid for it allows the creator to work on it fulltime and deal with VR-breaking updates ASAP." Like, Praydog's awesome, but Stalker 2 hasn't worked on UEVR since patch 1.6, almost half a year ago. I'd *love* for him to use the subscription method too, if it meant he could focus all his time on UEVR and fix games/make new ones at a much faster rate. And there are comments saying "Screw LukeRoss, getting rid of him will finally let us have VR in games without a paywall!" as if there's a ton of people lining up to make (and maintain) any VR mods at all, let alone good-quality ones, but just couldn't do it because RealVR is a paid service. All they're actually saying is, "Yeah screw paying for RealVR! I want to have...... NOTHING, instead!" Seriously Luke, don't pay any mind to the comments blasting you. It's THE INTERNET; most voices are a frothing illogical reactive mass of 5-second attention span users that enjoy wallowing in outrage. You could perform a service, for free, that provides healthy meals for orphans, and you'd get almost equally as much frothingly-enraged insults and personal attacks as you are getting now. Just treat it like the background noise it is, and do your thing: https://www.deviantart.com/jollyjack/art/Social-Media-1023124827

I choose option 3 because I'm thinking that would give people the most incentive to donate, but I'd be happy with any option that lets you keep working on it. I know you said splitting the framework from game title plugins is what already happens, and it didnt stop CDPR's take down request. However, might still be worth doing in additon to whatever donation strategy you choose ( CDPR's legal team won't know what a dll is, so the distinction should be spelled out). Could you also potentially look at other platforms too maybe? I'm gonna keep supporting in any case!

Futurama meme - Shut up and Take my money! 1. I find it odd that CDPR waited so long to send the initial legal notice. 2. Gave such little grace/consideration to your honest and reasonable approach and suggestions. Just seems suspicious, given that the Steam Frame is coming out soon… brings a few thoughts to mind. I wonder if they are planning to release or currently developing something VR related. What worries me is that it’s not abnormal for powerful entities to steal, cheat, steamroll weaker opponents. I.e. Thomas Edison v. Nikola Tesla. Fundamentally, powerfully entities generally tend not to operate for/from love of the art. Even their bottom line may not be their primary concern. It’s the constant power battle to be on top and remain there ad infinitum. JP Morgan, for example. I voted #4 because big game devs can kick rocks, there are a ton of great devs out there who would appreciate what you do! (I believe) the more games you can make VR compatible, the stronger your business will become! If you go with the free alternatives, it could be beneficial to have a different subscription system for donations specifically for legal defense.

How about: **** Do what makes you happy Luke. **** You made all this work because you wanted to to do something fun for yourself for a title you enjoyed and realized others enjoyed it too. Don't lose sight of that! Who are we to tell you what to do?

I want continued support for DMCA'd titles. Take my money. 74K3 4 H1K3 C0rP0 8r347H!

Option #6: trial version or, as veterans used to call it, "shareware" (combines Options 1-3). The framework is free, and so are game files, but the framework has limited functionality (e.g. only works for 10 minutes at a time, then you need to restart the game to get a new VR session). Every subscriber gets access to a monthly code. When that code is entered, it fully unlocks any framework published up to that point. Pros: all the pros from #1, plus a much better chance to get paid. Piracy can be mitigated by replacing codes that leak, and/or having personalized codes per member. Or turning everything into dog emojis when using a leaked code, whatever you prefer. :) Definitely not Option #4 or #5 for me. Because #4 removes value from the members (I only subscribed for *that one game*) and #5... bro, it's the Internet. Hating is free and anonymous, that should never determine your life choices. (You could also tweak #2 and #3 to be a rolling 3 or 6 month window, i.e. 3 months paid support for game X version Y, not for game X in general.) I'm voting #3 out of current choices, but what I really recommend is #6 above.

Option 6. Remove all mention of DMCA'd games and refer to then as their given name with leet-letters. cy832punk 4v474r 90und3d9 h057 0f 75u5h1m4 k1n9d0m c0m3 11 : d311v324nc3

Give yourself 6 months to tweek things and that also doesn't allow companies enough time to move against you in any legitimate way. We all know that updates can break your mods, 6 months would give you time to optimize the best, in my opinion. May seem longer than 3 but 6 months gives enough time and money for you to focus on the best mods possible.

You made my hobby even more enjoyable. I voted 4 because it seems the least unreasonable to me, but I'll support whatever you decide.

I’m a recent subscriber because I started playing Elden ring, and of course I wanted to play it in vr. The experience is amazing! I will continue to support your work regardless of whether it is free. I’d like to keep you full time on this work to support more games (if you enjoy it and if it is financially possible), so that rules out option 1. I’d like to maintain as many prior/existing games as possible, so that rules out options 4 and 5. That leaves 2 and 3. I chose option 3 as it seems to have the best chance of getting you enough financial support to add new games and maintain existing ones

I support you no matter what. Just don't shut down. The community appreciates you

I would much prefer to give you my vote back. I’m perfectly okay with it options 1 through 4 and will keep supporting even if the software is fully free. I really hope you don’t go for option 5, but there would be no hard feelings. I voted #4 because it seems to allow for the most games and the most subscribers. But this is your life’s work. How do YOU want to go about it? And you can readjust whenever you need, as far as I’m concerned.

I don't know much about coding, but would a variation of 1 be possible where you separate the core of the software into its own executable which you can offer on your Patreon? And then release the individual game modules for free as "compatibility mods" for free, that allow that game to be run through your executable? Really emphasizing that the product you're offering through subscription is its own separate thing that can technically run independently! But then if you want it to run with a particular game you neex to install the mod for that game to make ot compatible with the software? Otherwise, I voted for option 4. What you have is a custom framework that you make compatible with AAA games. You have a right to get paid for that (and yeah, calling it a mod for so long was probably a bad call, but you know what they say about hindsight). If the companies don't want compatibility then they can throw a fit. (I imagine the zips will still be floating out there anyway, so like you said, people can just choose not to update that game and continue playing anyway.) This seems like the safest option. I would personally suggest that you release individual game files separately so that if someone does get pissy and file a notice, you can take down the "offending" posts quickly without having to nuke the entire patreon and scrub the releases.

Hi Luke! Whatever you choose I will follow you! You got my word (ok you don’t know me personally but trust me please)! But more real, my advice : Option 2 seems reasonable as a test and to continue the highest vr experience of my life aka cyberpunk, and if it doesn’t work go for 4. But please never go to 5! I already said that by the past but you are a legend for people like me and for the young you! You made our dream came true : not just playing games but living the games from inside. For that I won’t be able to thank you enough… I will support you whatever it takes. And piracy already exist, if you go on option 2 and want to continue on 4 in the future, it will be just like now, people will have a ancient copy of your work, lesser compatible with time… so they will pay for the optimisation and support for the new upgrades of games. Whatever give me your price and I will support you. I can put a little more per month. Sincerely and friendly yours.

I'm super gutted about this whole thing. I'm torn between voting for 4 and 5. I'm considering 5 because LR you don't deserve any of this, and 4 just signs you up for more BS from foolish people. I would love to see a happy ending here, so I vote 4, but remember LR take care of yourself during this trouble. We'll be ok if you want out.

,Also regarding risk of dmca on option 1, Take Two went after other free mods at the same time as yours. Afaik they are the only publisher to try that. One of those modders fought back, took them to court, and won. I. E. Precedent already exists that free mods are safe, and directly related to your own gtav case. That's a slam dunk case. The same applies to 2 and 3 but in those cases it's unlikely they'd even hit c&d before the expiration moving it to free. And I'm ok with having to log in. As a vorpx user too, with a hardware key and the author having to email it manually to each customer reach reinstall this is comparatively simple. So long as you can promise like GabeN once did that if you do ever quit, you'll unlock it so we don't lose what we had.

My thinking for what it's worth: Option 1 - The haters win and there's insufficient financial incentive for Luke to keep this going. Option 2 - Still too many freeloaders and therefore insufficient financial incentive. Option 5 - our worst case scenario. We're left with options 3 and 4. Option 3 might manage risk a little better and be "safer", while Option 4 is more stick-it-to-the-man and plough on (You don't want incremental sales from VR customers? Fine, seeya). You could actually try both. Start with Option 4, but revert to Option 3 at a later time if the frequency of DMCA notices increases.

There is only one obvious best option. Definitely NOT 1 and 5. 1 only makes you technically alive but practically dead. You cannot survive on donations. Period. High-effort technical work requires predictable income. Option 3 and 4 are good choices but option 3 is the best. A good middle ground. In fact I also think making this a vote is a horrible decision. A community or not, a democracy and all that with good feelings, sure ok I can get that, but the past few weeks have shown us that people just can't comprehend the amount of work this takes or what the alternate will mean. I'm sure the amount of poison that is being spewed at you have even influenced many in the community. Option 1 shouldn't even be on the table, because come on, letting them win? A fighter or not, you can't.

I think the long term solution would be to make it free, donation based. I believe most of us already supporting will continue to do so regardless it's free or not. I personally donate the same amount as I pay here to UEVR and the newer no more flat.

I personally don’t want you to have to scale back. I’m option 4 all the way. Some publisher issues a take down, remove them. We all will still have the download. I have a separate version of your mod just for CDPR. And I want you to do what you love doing full time.

You'll continue to have my support. I voted option 2.

I voted 3, but am equally OK with 2. I think option 4 is just to risky. It opens up the same risks you've already hit, and for us, this fear of every game being on a timer poised to be taken away and forcing being rushed thru games isn't really fun. Id gladly accept if that's the chosen route and keep trucking with you, but it makes it harder to enjoy the games when they're under that much risk.

omg it’s obviously a -how have you not done this the moment you got the email?

I think you should base this more on the opinion of your legal advisors, not on our preferences. There's clearly an avenue for software like this (the examples you name), and I think most of us just want you to find it.

I’ve been subscribed for a little over a year now, I’ve put 400 hours on Cyberpunk in VR, and it quickly became the greatest gaming experience I have ever had. The seamless cutscenes and lack of loading screens paired with VR makes for the single greatest gaming experience ever. I truly believe that this tech is special, this VR port is so special, it would be a tragedy to see it all go to waste just because of some backlash, I understand why people were upset with the idea of needing to pay to get the software, but I believe that this is way more than a simple mod, it completely changes your experience and your connection to the game in a way that no “mod” could ever bring. I’ve been supporting you since I’ve downloaded the RealVR, I’ve paid every month because i honestly feel like $10 is a STEAL for something this incredible. I will continue to support you every month regardless of what happens. I beg everyone, keep this going, please don’t vote option 5 (or option 4 because I really need continued cyberpunk support) this is something that is too good to just throw away, this truly could change gaming Luke, thank you for everything you have done, thank you for what you have created, I’m so terribly sorry for everything you have faced since this has started. I really hope this isn’t the end

Is an Option 6 possible? I apologize that I'm behind on your messages and so you may have addressed this. What about if you completely disassociate the framework from the games? In other words, make the framework available to paid subscribers, but make "plug-ins" for individual games available to download at no cost? Would this still cause legal trouble? Also, THANK YOU for all of your incredible work over so many years!!!! Your dedication is beyond I credible!!! ❤️❤️

To be honest with you... None of the above. All the options you have presented are various levels of suck. Every one (except the last, and DONT do that) leave you vulnerable to the corp's fucking with you for free. How about option 6 - Roll out R.E.A.L VR (RVR) as a full on paid service ($10 per month) and getting the hell OFF of Patreon or other site with nervous disposition. Run the game specific settings and such the same as VORPX does. I suggest this as it is the ONLY option that puts you outside the "We can fuck with him any time we feel like it for zero cost, just a single email threatening DMCA" Every option you have presented is a variation of "They held their fist up threateningly and I am going to cringe and make myself Less for them" instead... Grow.. Bring RVR out covering every game you have done so far. Bring back RDR2. Hell.. bring back GTA5, and get ready for GTA6 when it finally releases. I have supported you from the start, and will continue to support you regardless of your choice going forwards. For me, the deal is and always has been "We cover you financially so that you can spend your professional time making fun stuff for us to play with" PS... if your in the same business model as VORPX etc... suing you would set a "precedent" for suing VORPX and others... Guess how VORPX would react to that...

Or if a game gets dmca remove it from patreon and THEN host it on MEGA or wherever and send the link to password protect .zip to Patreons and never use the game names.

Yeah, the time release idea was exactly what I thought a lawyer might recommend, as I did because of my familiarity with the IP scene (I'mNAL). It's what people who create derivative works professionally on Patreon and such do as well. As long as it is always released for free eventually, then they don't have legal standing to do anything, "fan content" EULA stuff not withstanding.

Everyone likes free, so obviously 1 would get the most votes. I feel 4 would benefit all parties. New support continues. You still have an income, I imagine we could just transfer the files from old versions to the new one to bring forward those lost titles (barring any game updates that break it). I would love to learn how you do add a new title to attempt getting something started while you focus your efforts elsewhere. As a passion piece. If it seems possible/promising, move it forward. I don’t care about money, I have a job that pays great, I’m just a guy who has dreamed of vr, and your methods make it so easy. I’d happily sign a NDA if required. Anyway, I say, 4, I know 1 will get the votes. I am a paid subscriber, so I have cast my vote. Either way, I hope this works out for you in the end!

I think you're pre-emptively and naively discounting the "paid DLL/free configuration payload" solution. No one at CDPR ever looked at your files; they have no idea how it works. That was never the issue. The ENTIRETY of this situation has been about how you phrased and marketed things. I think your hypothesis of "the corporate lawyers would just XYZ" is significantly flawed, after all, how is that different than VorpX or any of the others you mentioned? Build a small "Installer" tool which allows the user to select their game location and a payload, and have the installer copy the DLL and game payload. You'd be completely free and clear and there's not a damn thing their lawyers could say about it because all you've done is released a DLL and a program that installs it.

I'm staying subscribed anyway. It doesn't really matter to me. The PCVR industry owes you for it's continued existence in spite of everyone who tried to kill it.

This whole situation is so dumb. I'm happy to support older games and new ones just cut the whiny publishers

I read through the whole thing, whilst also trying to think about this from your perspective. I honestly think it would be unfair of me to vote. I think this is a very personal decision for yourself Luke. I already miss the download, there were so many titles I was ‘going to get around to playing’ but it’s your health, your fight and your product. Having developed myself, I really don’t think I can vote on all those cons in every situation my friend… Whatever you decide to do, you’d have my support. I was/am a member and if you do come back will continue to be.

Hi, i just wanted to say that sadly all options kind of suck, i’m barely new to this i think i joined last november, and to be honest i still havent used your framework to play anything ( i didn’t have time to see how it goes, and life makes things more difficult) but i just wanted to say that your work deserves to be paid, things won’t be like before, sadly, and probably you will find that money doesn’t come as often as it used to be. But as a personal oppinion, i would gladly pay for what you offer ( in fact i’m doing it and i still haven’t use it xD) what you do is awesome and lots of videos in youtube of happy users confirm that. Do whatever will give you less problems.

Bonjour, aucune idée, c’est complexe… mais merci pour le travail que vous faites, j’espère pouvoir le tester à la fin de ces mésaventures :) beaucoup de gens apprécient votre travail 🫶🏻

Here is idea I would convert older titles to VR. This would bring a dead title back to life.

Hey man just want to thank you for all your hard work. I built my first PC over last Christmas before prices went crazy. I have been dreaming of building a rig powerful enough for PC VR for years and finally took the plunge. Had no idea cyberpunk even had a vr mod until after i built my pc. Even on a 5070ti it truly is a life changing experience. I am fully convinced we’re all in the matrix now thanks to you because VR imperceptible to awareness of “real world” is definitely happening somewhere down the line in the future and your work has helped convince me of this. Sorry for all the trouble you’re going through but just want to tell you as a non jaded new PC gamer holy shit dude your work is mind blowing and looking forward to more work from you down the line!

I was planning on unsubbing any day now (before all the drama hit), but if you go free to D/L, I will keep my subscription going to support you. Considering what you said about Praydog, I will probably go subscribe to him as well. Those that are bringing us the joys of VR deserve to be supported, since 99% of game developers don't seem to give a crap about it.....

Long-time supporter, occasional commenter. I don't feel that the first three options give much assurance that DMCA (or more generally, legal battles) won't continue. And if game publishers want to go after you for your work, fuck 'em, I'm willing to just not play their games (or play them flat, I guess, whatever). There's almost no amount of money i wouldn't willfully throw your way in support of the work you're doing (and I hope you're already getting sound aka expensive legal advice), so "make it free" as in beer or not is not really a concern. But please, for the love of any good VR gaming (since Alex, still), keep doing the work. Do not, for the love of vr and my wallet, close up shop.

Nice to see options….im between 3 and 4 personally. Guys who are voting 1, remember that Luke would only be fixing 1 or 2 games a year as he cannot live on donations. Please read the email. Also why not option 5…remove the files completely off Patreon and provide a link in an email with password protected zip that’s hosted in dmca free country?

Been subscribed for a few months but following for a couple years. It’s your software and your framework. I would love to see you challenge them in court, and in case you do, you should check out Louis Rossmann on YouTube because it seems he’s looking for cases like yours. Anyway, fully support you continuing on as is and removing the games that complain. The people who never paid to support development or don’t genuinely cares about this don’t matter. Just my 2 cents. Might need to find a new host outside of Patreon though.

My vote is to keep the existing framework. The quality of your work is truly the best experience I’ve had in VR. I want to support that work as much as possible and I know others feel the same way. (If that doesn’t pan out please open your own studio man, your work is phenomenal)

This is a hard one. Closing shop is out of the question though. I'll keep on subscribing for as long as you make VR ports, if its free or not. Personally i vote for number 3.

Need cyberpunk vr

Try 2 adjust later options 4 or 5 always on the table anyways