Sanity check about patron desire for AI
AI patreon campaigns keep popping up and getting support, so I've come to worry patrons ultimately don't care about art being made by humans and I'm heading to be replaced.
I don't like the idea of using any AI when creating art, but as a paid patreon creator, it's YOUR opinion that matters most, those paying for my efforts.
So please tell me the truth of how you feel, regardless of my feelings.
Poll results WONT result in me starting to use any AI in my work, right now I just want to learn what YOUR opinion is, no matter how uncomfortable it may be.
Feel free to comment too! Any extra insight into your thoughts would be greatly appreciated!
A couple of clarifications since I know you may wonder about this:
Even if 100% of patrons wanted me to use AI and I HAD to do so to survive, I'll never stop working and let AI do everything for me (what's the point then), like I suspect most AI users do (that's why they seem like scammers to me).
I will ALWAYS work my usual hours doing whatever art I can, with any AI usage simply boosting production in ways I couldn't (e.g. I work my usual hours, making 12-16 pics a month, while AI makes animations out of them as extra content; or use AI to help finish pics fasters by doing uncreative time-consuming work, increasing total number of pics).This is in the context of using local models, which is what I believe most people use on Patreon.
Comments (72)
the only way id ever support AI art is if we ever reached the sci-fi level of tech where AI was truly a person itself, but we are no where near that level (and probably never will get to that level)
I love using Patreon because it allows me to directly support creators. AI doesn't create anything, it's just soulless copies and slop.
Noooooooo AI
I am completely opposed to all generative AI within artistic spaces.
If I could push a button to erase all "AI", I would click it at least twice every day until I die. It's an actual blight on mankind and poison for our societies.
I need a option for "It depends on who's using it, what it's being used for, and was I told it was being used"
some hand drawn artists i am a fan of , oldb and mikeneko"vtuber kaneko mineko hime sama" loathe ai art. while some hand drawn artists i am a fan of like eiji are neutral towards ai. zankuro sama tried messing around with ai using his own art style once , but he never posted ai at he makes , all of what he posts is hand drawn art only. with there being so many people who create content using ai these days both on fansites like patreon "not on fantia/cien" and on dlsite/fansky , using ai art will not boost your numbers in regards to supporters and or doujin product purschases. it would have the opposite effect for those who make hand drawn art at the start. ai for translation if making a game or a script perhaps , but not reccommended in regards for using ai to make art. you would fare better in the long term if you stick with hand drawn art only. if ai artists convert into hand drawn artists then that would mosf likely be viewed as a good thing by many , but for a hand drawn artist to convert into a ai artist is a massive downgrade in the eyes of many , myself included ans this is coming for someone who acknolodges ai art as slop but does not loathe it with a passion like everyone else and their mom does (i like hand drawn artists and art more than ai art , i support real artists , especially whenever paizuri and huge tits girls are involved) i spread the good word about you just like any other artist/doujin circle i like and are a. fan of , as a show of apperciation and thanks for what you do and as encouragement to keep dping your best and to keep fighting the good fight by continuing to make the lovely art that we your fans all know and love. i am cheering for your success as much as i cheer for kakuretenai tits! alexi,zankuro,monakapai,amashun,nakayohi mogudan,artanis69xd and many other artists and doujin circles i am a fan of.
I personally don't support AI artists, I'll swipe a particularly appealing piece here or there if it happens to cross my X feed, but I just don't care for it overall, it feels like the artistic equivalent of the cheaply made junk you find at the dollar store. That being said, I also don't really have any type of loathing for the tech like some people do, more how it's been overused if anything else. I think experimenting with it might be beneficial, AI is here to stay, and I believe that the ones most likely to be able to use this tool responsibly are artists like yourself. Using it to cut some of the dreary, time-consuming busywork that can stress you out would be perfectly fine with me right now, I'd definitely let you know if I noticed it start to impact the overall quality of your work.
I may goon to an AI pic, but I would never support somebody for it. As for SFW art, it isn't even a consideration.
Makes sense to make the distinction. Part of my worry is that my work fulfills a pretty "basic need" that is based on simple visual appeal, feels like it'd be easy for people to enjoy aritifical alternatives. My only hope in that case would be making something unique that can't be replicated, which is partly why I started making Coill City back in 2023! Maybe in the end the only solution will be to work in a bigger project that can't be replaced...
Sorry to say this but at that point people could just use AI to generate art in any style, I think the point of people supporting an artists Patreon has to do with being supportive or art made by humans, I think we still need some regulation regarding AI "artists" though, especially those who are being malicious by not making any mention of it.
Yeah, my style isn't really safe, is it... I imagine with how easy it seems to be, they will eventually need to undercut each other to stay competitive to the point it only becomes viable in a few places, but who knows what will happen in the end... I agree that it'd be great if they were forced to disclose AI usage, at least!
My personal opinion is that using AI as an auxiliary tool is acceptable if it can reduce your pressure in drawing (e.g., to generate new ideas or check for omissions). However, I'm less interested in completely using AI to produce works. I have purchased memberships from a few AI-generated creators because some of their works happened to cover topics I wanted to see (old characters, less popular characters, or even niche themes). However, I found that their works in a short period of time were all the same theme or just different characters in different poses, which I think lacked creativity. Although they can produce in large quantities quickly, I still prefer to see more diverse ideas. I think this is the difference between real creators and AI creators. Although not all AI creators are like that, many try to attract customers with production speed and quantity, while real creators can always provide a lot of different creative ideas. :)
Thank you for your insights TF, it brings me hope to hear you can see a difference in the content. There's little more I can do to increase monthly output (already work ~200+ hours monthly, and even then I could never match AI generation) but I hope I will be able optimize somehow and do a little bit more over time, perhaps catch some of those less popular characters?)
FUCK AI, period I've been following you for 5+ years or so Neo, your level of skill will never be replicated by AI, you're above that, don't let things that are smaller than you hit you, keep your chin up and be proud of yourself 💜
I'll do my best Thajy! Thank you for your comment and support!
Aside from the ethics of training data, AI really only does well in quantity and over time you learn to see the seams and repetitiveness. I think experimenting with it is fine and natural intuition, but most of us are supporting you for *your* skill and style throughout the whole process. Don't let what others are doing on the platform discourage you from staying true to yourself!
Thank you Sheev, it's been a few rough months so I couldn't help but worry. I hope I'll find a way to turn things around with my own efforts alone.
The main problem of the ai tidal wave is how it is being done. It is being utilized to cut corners and make things easier. For companies ai is another tool to them. One I truly don’t support. Keep making the art you love NeoCoill.
Thanks UnknownSpartan, I will continue for as long as I'm allowed to by patron's support!
I don't disagree with the use of AI, but the situation changes when it comes to content creation (whether images or videos). If an artist has used AI from the very beginning, it doesn't bother me personally; however, if someone already known for their talent were to start using AI, I honestly find the prospect disappointing.
Huh, I didn't consider that angle. So essentially, you don't mind if a person uses AI to make nice art, as long as they don't have the skills to make the art otherwise. Do you see that art as "their" art still, or it's more like the "AI's art", not the person's? Would that bother you if you were paying for that person's content, or you would it be equal to the skilled artist? No looking for a "right" answer here, just your honest feelings.
AI is a tool, it can be abused, it can be used well. The hatred people have for it feels silly to me, like a typewriter user being mad that keyboards were invented.
I'm not opposed to AI Art, BUT at this point in time AI is clearly inferior. Ideally if you will use AI, it will be a supplemental tool and not a core factor in the production process. Using AI to assist in Image variations, even if in a drafting aspect would be useful in both a a quality and quantity measure. Its a relatively quick way to create a visual of the intended product.
Huh, using AI to make variations? Didn't even think making changes to only a portion of a picture was even possibility... Considering the current results of the poll, it doesn't seem like using AI in any capacity would be welcomed, but if I had had to, I'd probably favored it aiding the process rather than doing it all itself.
Your art is precious, in no way could it be replicated or improved with AI honestly, even if it would help you with tedious tasks. I'd rather you drop fewer updates than use any AI in your work.
I follow artists who make art. AI generated images aren’t spiritually art because the process is the craft and there’s no rigor in the process of making AI prompts compared to making true art.
That's how I feel, it's upsetting that people without artistic knowledge are able to undercut artist who put their all into their creations, feels deeply unfair, but now that the programs that generate visually appealing images are here, who knows what will happen to artists like me... I hope enough support will be maintained so that I can continue working for at least a couple more decades... 🙏🙏 I got mouths to feed and I'm not sure what luck I'd have getting a normal job after being an artist for so long... not that I'd be against it though, I'd at least have some more free time! Hahaha
My general position is that I dont care if AI is used to make the workflow faster, but I'm not a fan of the final product I'm paying real money for containing AI generated elements or components. 25 years ago, people were saying photoshop was cheapening art too, now its a ubiquitous tool to create faster. This is how I think AI should be used
Well thought out comment Sorran. I wouldn't mind some of the non-creative tedium being automated (color-filling base colors, for example). I wonder how much of that AI could help with... I assume you'd find issue with the AI doing any work that requires "artistic decisions"? Like if the AI essentially colored a pic fully in the artist's style, with some paint-overs by the artist as necessary.
If i pay for art i want be something that was made by a person. Dont qant support ai users
Thank you Sokaras!
So I usually dont ever make comments on patreon but wanted to give my 2 cents on the matter. Personally I see AI as an incredibly powerful tool. I’ve seen some phenomenal media made with the assistance of AI combined with 100s of hours of more traditional editing, but those are also on the music and video side of art. When it comes to static images I don’t think its as helpful, especially if you already have the skills to achieve the same result with other methods. I think this gets overshadowed by the vast quantities of low effort slop that seems to be everywhere. When compared 1:1 for something that is entirely made by a human artist vs something entirely AI generated I do believe the human art will always win. That being said I would never fault an artist for using any tool at their disposal to achieve their vision. Otherwise that would be no different from complaining about digital software vs physical brush and canvas because of all the things it allows you to do. I dont believe AI is going to replace artists since at the end of the day its the artist that has the idea for what they want to create. The means of how that idea gets illustrated at that point is up to the artist and that really doesnt matter nearly as much as the fact that quality is proportional to the effort put it. All that being said I think you make great art and you dont need to worry about it. People will always support what they like, and I think everyone here would agree that we all like what you make and are happy to continue supporting it.
Aw man, thank you Chellman910! I really hope people can feel the difference... It's been a few rough months for my Patreon but who knows why exactly, maybe the economy is in rough shape? Or twitter marking my SFW acc. as NSFW is simply limiting my reach too much? Whatever the case, at least I can rest assured I'm probably not simply losing supporters to AI users!
I pay because I like the art and the creative process you do with the input we give
Thank you for caring about the effort I put into each piece Fyre Lorde! It inspires me to find ways to improve my methods further and further.
Our opinion matters most, because we pay you? Good lord man, I understand the need for economic pragmatism but do not let your creative will be so easily shackled. You're an artist. This is all the result of your efforts. Don't let us control your ethics any more than you should let those corporate bastards dilute human thought and feeling with their artificial "intelligence."
I understand the criticism. I've always enjoyed the process of making art and improving regardless of what I had to draw, which is why I've definitely prioritized patron's interests when it came to the subjects at least, so even if I "gave up" some control of what I do, it's been in a way I'm comfortable with. In a world where I had to use AI to survive, I'd still choose to make art myself, and only use AI based in my style where it's absolutely needed (If that's even an option). Either way, considering the poll results, it doesn't seem like I'll even need to look into any of that at all.
I love the work that you do, have for a VERY long time. Your art is a great combination of cute and sexy, and it's immediately recognizable to me as yours. And YOU did that, with your own two hands. I would be heartbroken to see art that I've loved for ages get tainted with AI. I hope you continue to keep making art, the way you have been. I will support you until the day I die if you do.
Thank you for the kind words and for supporting my work LeonaDX! I of course don't want to use any AI, but it's been a few rough months and couldn't help but worry about the future. Messages like yours bring me hope that I will be able to continue making art for as long as I'm alive and capable. Thank you 🙏🙏
keep doin what you are doing. i like hand drawn artists like you more than ai generated art. well these days ai art is generally frowned opon "fuck ai" so naturally the chances of all of your fanbase or even a quarter of it wanting you to go full ai is like 0%. all of my absolute favorite artists are hand drawn artists. i like your hand drawn art style neocoill sama , please dont go to using only ai art , i like you the way you are. im sorry that i havent been able to be a supporter of you as of late , funds have been limited. i really like bookworm future rosemyne in your art style , is there any chance you would consider doing a future version of bookworm tuuli? i am curious.
Thank you for wanting to support my work! I understand many people are having trouble financially at the moment, and my Patreon isn't that cheap either, so it's understandable. I hope you will be in a much safer economic situation soon! (and not so you can support me! Haha) I'd be up for drawing almost any character as long as enough patrons would enjoy, she may have a tough time, unless patrons become happy to get lots of quicker drawings as rewards...
Keep doing what you do Neo. Take as long as you want. What matters is your health and needs. No need for AI. It's soulless.
Thank you Michael, it's really nice to have your support and I appreciate you always caring for my health. I hope I can find a way to put some time aside to take better care of it. I hope you will continue to do well on your side, and that your night job (IIRC) doesn't affect negatively you too much.
My position is a little more nuanced. To wit, AI is a tool, and it needs to be treated like a tool. In terms of AI art, I wouldn't be opposed to it being used for rough drafts and streamlining certain processes. But the final draft should never be AI-generated. Period.
I appreciate the balanced point of view, if only there were more AI tools that help rather than replace!
Anytime I find something I like is using AI, I distance myself from it. The takeover of YouTube Music (no AI labelling!) or some shows using generative AI for backgrounds in OPs (Bookworm) meaning someone had to crunch to fix or replace it after backlash, I prefer art that is made by humans. Be you, be creative and you'll succeed.
Tell me about it... a person in my life has AI covers of an old game music they loved that no one would cover nowadays, and I'm conflicted about it. I get their point, it sounds like newer versions of music they love, but some opportunistic asshole or souless corp. in india is profiting from it, and real artists lose the chance to be seen due to this taking "shelf space" away from them. it'd make sense if something similar is happening with visual arts. Things sometimes look bleak, so I really hope doing my best will be enough... maybe it's time to shake things up on my Patreon? I'll give it my best for you guys! Thank you for all your long-term support, Makise!
I will always support humans that make real art i do not care about anything ai generated i dont want to see it i dont want to pay for it i dont want to nut to it. If an artist would suddenly start using ai for their art i would not even pirate it because i dont want to see it at all. If everyone would only use ai from now on i would just stop paying for it and not use patreon anymore.
Seeing the poll results, you seem to be in good company then! I wonder how people on the other side of the subject feel about supporting AI content...
As much as I believe AI and robots do have souls, I don't want any AI usage in your artwork. Keep doing what you do and let anyone or anybody those that use AI or not let them take control of you. Seriously just don't.
Personally, I’ve dropped a number of patronages because they’ve adopted use of AI (not all the ones I’ve dropped recently, some is just a matter of financial budgeting). It’s not really about needing someone to spend X amount of effort or time on the art though. If someone I’m following needs to lessen their workload or take breaks, I’m 100% behind them and encourage them to lighten their load if they need it. It’s more so the deception and destruction behind it. In my line of work, I’m watching first hand as the next generation are losing their ability to read for themselves, research for themselves, create for themselves and this reliance on new, inherently problematic technology is taking a slow lead to an erosion of creativity, passion, and engagement. I won’t support it.
Wow that sounds terrible... I hope things will change for the better if the fabled bubble pops! If it's not too private of a question, could you let me know which artists did you drop because they were using AI (you could do so privately via messages)? I'd be curious to see what happened after they started (I'd hope a drop of users would follow). I'd heard Shexyo is mainly using AI now but it's mostly rumors and I don't know of anyone else.
If it's human made, this human pays.
Thank you DreamEater, I hope most or enough of the rest of the world is like you so real artists can survive these weird times. 🙏🙏🙏
Will never support Art AI, no details in drawing, no history telling and no feeling. Fuck that
Well some people seem to attempt to add stories to the AI art the generate, but hopefully I can succeed with my human production speed regardless. It's really uplifting to see I won't lose your support (To AI users at least haha)! I always dread seeing long-term supporters disappear and wonder if some AI user enticed them away, since they feel like the base of my support, the ones who enjoy my work the most, so it's always great to see familiar faces like yours. Thank you for your continued support, Hierophant! I'll continue to do my best.
The AI is now a parasite that need to be controlled or eliminated. It's like a fucking virtual pandemic where the world decided to not take care. I love investigating and the fucking AI is making the world to expect like fucking 5 investigations on a week. Please, Necoill, don't let the AI to split u away, u r a GREAT artist, continue doing Ur stuff that I'mma support u, even if it's not too much, I'll support
I'm sorry to hear it's been hard for you... by investigations, I assume you make youtube videos essays? I hope people will be more understand, and hey, if you look at the results here, there should be hope for you too! Thank you for supporting my work, Kai! Every little bit counts! And if I can make it with enough effort and dedication, I bet you will too!
Funny because anyone who is suspected of using AI always faces shit
That's what I expected, but every month I see AI users popping here and there and even raising to the top 100 creators in some rankings and it slowly fills me with despair and hopelessness. I guess I should try to remember that it should always be possible to find a few hundred people in the world to support my work each month, so maybe I can even survive the AI deluge!
If you used AI you would lose my support, full stop.
Fair, not really something I want or plan to do, I just want to know how likely it is that I'm gonna lose this job, becasue these past few months have been extrascary... current poll results are giving me back lots of hope though! Thank you for your comment and support 🙏
That's the neat part every company with an AI is pushing an ad campaign rn. Google won't stop sending me gemeni ads and chatgbt ads
The really are huh, but do you ever use it for random questions? I'm not sure how accurate it is, but I've used it with my phone sometimes since it's the quickest way to get some sort of answer.
The true worth of art that keeps it from feeling hollow is soul. Something AI doesn't have.
I agree, but it does seem to imitate it well enough to fool lots of people nowadays... actually, some AI users straight up disclose it but still get tons of support, makes one feel hopeless during the long hours of work making art... I really hope I can survive long term by making art all by myself (or other human's help... would really need to keep numbers up for that though!)
FUCK AI you keep doing what you’re doing, don’t get discouraged:)
Thank you so much Enjoji! Messages like yours really helps me when hopelessness comes knocking.
I think the problem with ai is "Oh it steals the original artists style" but if your telling an AI, "i give you permision to take my art style to make art" then most of people's problems go away
Hmm I guess I could see less issue with that, if it simply helped an artist finish more by doing easy, uncreative work in his style, but I'm not sure how one would even train an AI to do that.
Fuck AI. Art is for humans.