Testifying to Love: Avalon (feat. Josh Boerman)
Christian Rock Summer comes to a close with something a little softer, melodic, and worshipful. On today's episode, Josh Boerman (The Worst of All Possible Worlds, Ill Conceived) returns to testify to love and also cause some name confusion by joining Josiah and Josh Christianson for a conversation about the Christian vocal quarter, Avalon, and the state of CCM in the 90s. It turns out, it was pretty homophobic.
Follow Josh on Bluesky @bosh.worstpossible.world
Listen to The Worst of All Possible Worlds: worstpossible.world
Listen to Ill Conceived: https://www.illconceivedpodcast.com/
Become a Fruitless Patron here: https://www.patreon.com/user?u=11922141
Check out Fruitless on YouTube
Find more of Josiah’s work: https://linktr.ee/josiahwsutton
Follow Josiah on Twitter @josiahwsutton
References
Avalon Essentials, Spotify Playlist, https://open.spotify.com/playlist/55mkNaVTJ3mJJRevfFB1hi
God Gave Rock and Roll to You: A History of Christian Contemporary Music by Leah Payne
"Michael Passons (Pt 1) Breaks Silence: His Truth About Avalon, Christian Music & 20‑Year Return," The Patrick Custer Show on YouTube, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmWXtnECYP0
"Michael Passons' Full Story (Pt 2): Forced Out of Avalon, Out of The Closet & Conversion Therapy," The Patrick Custer Show on YouTube, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ9ctLW-2Yo
"Michael Passons Says His Sexuality Was the Real Reason for Leaving Avalon," Joe Lynch in Billboard, https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/michael-passons-avalon-9447362/
"Former Avalon singer on coming out, getting ousted and where he is today," Joey DiGuglielmo in Washington Blade, https://www.washingtonblade.com/2020/10/20/former-avalon-singer-on-coming-out-getting-ousted-and-where-he-is-today/
"Former Avalon Member Melissa Greene to Jen Hatmaker: Christian Music Was Built on the ‘Back of So Many Queer People,’" Jessica Mouser in ChurchLeaders, https://churchleaders.com/news/2218790-avalon-melissa-greene-jen-hatmaker-christian-music-queer-people.html
Audio credits
Jesus Freak - DC Talk
Testify to Love - Avalon
Avalon on the Oxygen Tour in 2001, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIRRO1bswqc
Yesterday - bloom.
Give It Up - Avalon
Testify to Love, from Touched by an Angel, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvzaIUpo2Rk
Knockin' On Heaven's Door - Avalon
Can't Live a Day - Avalon
Can't Live a Day (DJ Tiesto Remix) - Avalon
Part 2 of the Michael Passons interview on the Patrick Custer Show, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ9ctLW-2Yo
Testify to Love - Michael Passons + Ty Herndon (feat. Melissa Greene)
Bass - NoCopyrightMusic
Comments (20)
Oh god this episode is giving my so many war flashbacks. I had completely forgotten about Stephen Curtis Chapman’s “This is Your Time.” I went to a Christian dance studio as a child and they made either me or another young girl do this for a solo for a production one year! And! We did “The Great Adventure” for a group number another year! And my church choir sang “Testify to Love” all the fucking time. My childhood is so entwined with CCM and I didn’t even like it 😭
Oh God am I an Avalon sicko
I had a His Kids radio in my room forever and ever. Also grew up listening to WCSG and JQ99 and the Woofer.
Grew up in GR, really feels crazy that I encountered this podcast.
I could feel internal rage as you were imitating the CCM communication style. Well done.
It’s me, I’m the Avalon Sicko. Grew up with a Southern Baptist youth pastor dad who was big into the CCM world in the 90s. He managed to book them to play at our local high school football stadium in 2000, and I remember it being a huge deal (I was 8). I got to meet the band after the show and even got their autographs on a glossy promo photo. I distinctly remember the smell of the sharpie ink and later propping the photo up on my dresser and trying to never touch it so I wouldn’t get my fingerprints on it lol. My former church also did a “Creative Movement” (it’s definitely not dancing! iykyk) rendition of Testify to Love that I participated in (and still remember the moves to) I had a big gay crush on Janna which makes Josh’s assumption about the Michael situation extra heartbreaking. I love and support reclaiming TTL as a queer anthem. Long live Michael, long live queer artists 💕
Bobson Dugnut still there as of 8/11 2026
Amazing my boy Bobson is still up. 🫡
love that the T.R.U.T.H. member list reads like a mormon spinal tap
alright, alright, i subscribed, you got me, what was i gonna do, not listen to this?!
I didnt know about the His Kid's Radio, but I grew up listening to WCSG and JQ99 (which is a whole other story). I stopped listening to WCSG in 4th grade because I was listening to it one night after bed and they were playing a sermon on Revelations and the stuff about the bugs that look like women scared the everloving shit out of me
I grew up listening to this flavour of CCM and it baffles me that my dad, who took me to my first Iron Maiden concert at 14 and gave me his old motley Crüe CDs, worked in the CCM/southern gospel scene as long as he did. He hates this shit, and yet he still goes to play bass or do sound for his church every week so they can play songs with no drums. Just bizarre
Oh hell yes
Learning that Truth is the Christian Hawkwind in terms of membership
Bobson Dugnutt is still on that Wikipedia page 🤞
I think my family still has a His Kid's Radio sitting in the kitchen
I’d be lying if I said I hadn’t thought about Avalon in 25 years, because for some reason their song The Glory has haunted me this entire time. Also the talk of Sparrow Records reminded me of the Smash-Ups album which is the only CCM record for which I have true nostalgia. Does anybody else remember this album??
I've definitely seen the album art at some point, but hadn't checked it out until now. There's some moments where the mash up hits, but also feels like Temu Girl Talk
WOW Worship mentioned!
My god, the sense memories I have of being outside listening to this album on my parents' backyard speaker when I was a kid...
