I Hate the ‘90s feat. John Ganz (E282)
Do you look back on the early 90s with a sense of fondness? In this episode, we hope to ruin that for you just a little bit. What if we told you that this time period was crucial in the development of American right wing populism and therefore crucial for the eventual election of Donald Trump and the rise of QAnon? Bet you’re a little less nostalgic for those slap bracelets now.
We speak with John Ganz, author of the new book When the Clock Broke: Con Men, Conspiracists, and How America Cracked Up in the Early 1990s. He explains how KKK Grand Wizard David Duke, Economist Murray Rothbard, Paleoconservative Pat Buchanan, Texas Tycoon Ross Perot, and other colorful figures helped to lay the groundwork for the results of the 2016 election and all its consequences.
When the Clock Broke: Con Men, Conspiracists, and How America Cracked Up in the Early 1990s
https://us.macmillan.com/books/9780374605445/whentheclockbroke
John Ganz on Twitter
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Editing by Corey Klotz. Theme by Nick Sena. Additional music by Pontus Berghe. Theme Vocals by THEY/LIVE (instagram.com/theyylivve / sptfy.com/QrDm). Cover Art by Pedro Correa: (pedrocorrea.com)
QAA was formerly known as the QAnon Anonymous podcast.
Comments (53)
Of all the episodes where Ghostbusters would be relevant to reference and Jake didn't mention?? (Re common theme of media at the time for business resisting regulations were portrayed as righteous underdog mavericks going against conniving inhumane bureaucrats for the good of humanity and dreams, especially in regards to environmental regulation, instead of bloodthirsty corporations rationalizing poisoning entire towns to save their shareholders a few bucks)
Excellent episode, But please.. ‘neoliberal’ is NOT ‘new liberal’ or whatever you think it is, Jake! Neoliberalism is “a term used to signify the late-20th-century political reappearance of 19th-century ideas associated with free-market capitalism.” A Neoliberal is “an advocate or supporter of free-market capitalism, deregulation, and reduction in government spending”. The New Left in contrast is a movement that grew out of the counterculture of the 60s and embraced civil rights, ‘green’ ideals etc… what we would now call “progressive”. Neoliberals are people like Ronald Reagan, Margaret Thatcher and Bill Clinton though he also championed some left of center ‘lib’ (left) causes like raising taxes on the wealthy. They embraced market-based economic policies and deregulation a la Milton Friedman. I’m not sure what you think it means but I don’t think it is what you think. It does not refer to moderate Democrat/mainstream lib social values…
I also have a POWMIA flag guy on my street that has a ginormous yard that he keeps perfect
Newbie to the Patreon and getting started on the Premium backlog. It's really cool to be reminded of how far y'all have come. =) Thanks for all your years of hard work!
'anarcho' capitalism.
Also -Special place in hell for small business owners. Capitalist excess while feeling like the underdog.
I just have to share this with people who would get it. I was at a wedding this weekend at which the step father of the groom was an actual member at bohemian Grove. Hand to God he was wearing an owl tie because " my silly club for stuffy old men still demands that we were ties to events and our mascot is an owl so these are the only ties I have anymore." I nodded innocently.
Someone I once knew was, reputedly, a member of BG. I was never sure whether to believe it, because he was both extremely well-connected and a supreme bullshitter. But since I never saw him wearing an owl tie, it now seems slightly less likely.
Growing up, my mom taught me good principals, and because my grandfather was union, good pro-labor values, but never, ever talked politics. The only time in my life I can recall my mom being politically engaged was when she was excited about voting for Ross Perot. So, absolutely, "the outsider" paved some sort of path for everyone to drop everything and pay attention to to the guy who's not the same old, same old, but "different", because he said he is.
I was really waiting for Julian to scream out Ghislaine Maxwell was convicted of trafficking minors to *nobody* apparently
I still have my Sega Genesis console and Sonic game.
Such a great episode.
Small business owners = Jeffersonian “self-sufficient” yeoman farmers with house payments.
Off topic but pertinent. Reuters reported to today on the Pentagon dabbling in anti vax propaganda to counter China’s covid aid to its neighbours… https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-covid-propaganda/
Libertarianism, aka "real capitalism has never been tried."
Okay, the "slap bracelet injury" joke is awesome because when I was 13 I peeled the plastic off of a slap bracelet to reveal what was essentially just sheet metal under and I ended up slicing my wrist wide open....
The small businesses section reminded me that the demographic that disproportionately voted to put the Nazi party in power was small to medium business owners. Just a coincidence im sure. If anyone hasn’t read Eco’s “Ur Fascism” i highly recommend it.
Petit bourgeois is unfortunately a very useful phrase.
Sorry to the New Haven pizza guy but the reason you can't have your charcoal pizza restaurant is NOT because of Gruesome Gavin but actually because of AQMD restrictions on retail food emissions that date back to the early 90s.
Don't remember what Ross Perot looks/sounds like, only Dana Carvey. They should put Dana Carvey's picture in the history book to properly preserve his legacy.
Love Ganz, so glad you had him on. I think his work connects a lot of dots. When are Matt and Sam from Know Your Enemy coming on?
Great interview! To the idea of Trump voters maybe expecting wealth through sheer proximity: is “internalized trickle-down economics” a term? Can we make it a term?
Are we gonna get a QAA crossover with Unclear and Present Danger??
45 min in: reminds me of the stab-in-the-back myth - or dolstoßlegende - that many veterans of the Great War in Germany used as a pretense to revitalize militant nationalism, imperialism, and antisemitism in the 'inter-war' period. A lot of dudes who served in the war on terror feel similarly based on conversations I've had with other veterans. Pretty horrible stuff.
so, retro gamers are fascist?
Yes.
It seems like kinda a big fumble to mention birtherism as something Trump created and completely forgetting that Hillary’s campaign against Obama was the real origin point.
Check out Fantasyland: How America Went Haywire by Kurt Anderson. Seems Americans have always been pining for a nostalgic rose tinted past.
The klan used antisemitism as a part of their efforts to fight civil rights
It's not remarkable that he also hated Jews they were our allies in the fight to fight oppression during the civil rights era
Humbly if I may correct the line I would say something more like "it's remarkable that the politics allowed a man that associated himself with terrorism against 13% of the country, but he also hated the Jews and that's a huge issue"
His point about larger politics was correct!
I've listened to the part several times and it just is what it is
I mean this in good faith, and I love this podcast and will stay subscribed. Why would anyone say this series of words?
There is this quote that bothered me from the podcast 'I thought it was remarkable that he wasn't rejected for his antisemitic views he was rejected for his anti black views'
Is this not remarkable considering the current political climate where people seem to react in the exact opposite?
It’s pretty easy to riff on the paleo conservatives and anarcho capitalists for romanizing the past, their shitty beliefs goes all the way back to the Old Testament…... The uncomfortable dirty secret is our far-left flank romanticizes a fictitious past too with the tenants of back to the land anarcho primitivism, a world pre colonialism
paleocons and ancaps have had a not insignificant impact on broader politics and have a lot of material support behind them to incorporate them into the larger right-wing movement. Can you really say the same about anarcho-primitivists and "the left" as it is in this country? Like socialist and decolonial movements trying to fix inequities created by past exploitation are not saying we should go back to subsistence farming what are you talking about
If you lived outside the Anglosphere 90s nostalgia is *even* less justified.
Greetings, It is I, Rachel Maddow. Entertain me (not too much)!
Well hello, Rachel Maddow
Anyone else missing this episode from the feed on Pocket Casts? Refresh didn’t fetch it for me.
In addition to being a "polite Nazi," Pat Buchanan was also friends with Hunter S Thompson.
Speaking of Ecco the Dolphin I don't remember if y'all have covered John C Lily but if not you should
Why would you do this?
Your explanation of neo-conservatives reminded me of the 2022 film Armageddon Time centered on a Jewish family in New York. The grandfather is an immigrant, and the family wants to be upwardly mobile and have their sons assimilate and gain cultural capital. They send their sons to conservative private school which features Maryanne Trump as a guest speaker. The protag is a son who wants to be an artist and is struggling with internalizing the racist rhetoric around him against Black people. Knowing about who many neo-cons are really helps make the film make sense in hindsight.
Pat Buchanan was long overdue for some coverage on this show. He was a very influential PoS despite failing to win the Republican presidential primaries in '92 and '96.
My dad would drive us by a particular house that had a huge Buchanan banner during those primaries. We called it the Nazi house.
I've listened to an audiobook on Bill Cooper like 3 months ago and it's still ruining my life. let's go!
I accidentally downloaded a Bill Cooper audiobook for the first time when I was looking for a book for college history class called William Cooper's Town, quickly realized it wasn't about Cooperstown.
Nooooooooooo!!!! How dare you!!!
a link to my past!
Nooo not my 90s!