Bookclub 2: Moby Dick (Chpt 1-44)
Anyone interested in participating--- I want to set a tentative date for Saturday August 1st, 7:30 PM EST. My childcare for the summer was cancelled and so... I have less time than expected.
As for the book---I think any version should be fine. I will be reading from Moby Dick Penguin Classics Deluxe Edition with a Forward by Nathanial Philbrick. In my edition chapter 44 ends on page 220 which I think is a good enough place to stop. So let's say read the first 44 chapters in any edition you have.
Obviously you can read farther I just think a book this large is too daunting to hit in 6/7 weeks. Everyone has lives and things to do. I am also rereading the Odyssey right now hopefully before the movie comes out.
If you have not read Moby Dick---It does get better as it goes along. The story gets very INTENSE towards the end. So many metal bands have based concept albums on it for a reason. So I would encourage you to go farther if you are enjoying it. The livestream will be limited to the first 44 chapters though to avoid spoilers.
I love this idea so much. I love bookclub.
Comments (26)
Count me in for Moby-Dick conversation.
I joined the patreon for this book club.
I'm really enjoying the book. This will be an insanely long post that probably will exceed the allowed comment length but oh well. There was one passage in chapter 26 about democracy that I loved: "Nor can piety itself, at such a shameful sight, completely stifle her upbraidings against the permitting stars. But this august dignity I treat of, is not the dignity of kings and robes, but that abounding dignity which has no robed investiture. Thou shalt see it shining in the arm that wields a pick or drives a spike; that democratic dignity which, on all hands, radiates without end from God; Himself! The great God absolute! The centre and circumference of all democracy! His omnipresence, our divine equality!" I asked ChatGPT for some context about the passage and also my opinion that the left in America can sometimes forget how revolutionary the US was to think a large nation could be ruled by democracy. The response from ChatGPT was interesting. Of course it is "yes and-ing" me but it is responses like this that I find quite amazing from a software system, there aren't many people that I can have discussions this interesting with: Yes — that passage is **very American**, and more specifically it is one of the places where *Moby-Dick* sounds like a radical democratic sermon. The immediate context is Chapter 26, “Knights and Squires,” where Ishmael is introducing **Starbuck**, the chief mate. The chapter’s title is mock-aristocratic: Melville borrows the language of chivalry — knights, squires, nobility — and applies it to working sailors on a Nantucket whaling ship. That is the key move. ## What the passage is doing Melville is saying: real dignity does **not** come from rank, costume, inheritance, title, throne, or aristocratic display. It shines in: > “the arm that wields a pick or drives a spike” That is, in labor. Manual labor. Ordinary embodied work. So when he says: > “this august dignity I treat of, is not the dignity of kings and robes” he is rejecting the European/aristocratic idea that dignity descends from social hierarchy. Instead, he offers what he calls: > “that democratic dignity” This is not merely political democracy in the sense of voting. It is metaphysical democracy: the claim that human dignity radiates from God into all persons, not just elites. That last line is almost ecstatic: > “The great God absolute! The centre and circumference of all democracy! His omnipresence, our divine equality!” He is grounding equality in divine omnipresence. If God is everywhere, then no class or rank monopolizes holiness. The divine is present in the sailor, the laborer, the harpooneer, the outcast, the “common” man. ## Why the “permitting stars” line matters The first part of the quotation is darker: > “Nor can piety itself, at such a shameful sight, completely stifle her upbraidings against the permitting stars.” He is saying that even religious faith struggles not to protest when it sees noble human beings degraded by poverty, injustice, or social contempt. That is a very Melvillean move: he can sound religious and rebellious in the same sentence. Piety remains piety, but it still “upbraids” heaven. It asks: how can the universe permit this? So the passage is not simple patriotic optimism. It is democracy born out of outrage at humiliation. ## The American quality of the passage I agree with you: this is one of the great democratic American strains, and it can get obscured when American history is reduced only to its crimes. Those crimes are real. Slavery, Native dispossession, racial hierarchy, and imperial violence are not footnotes. But there was also something genuinely revolutionary in the American rejection of hereditary monarchy and aristocratic rank. The idea that a nation could be grounded, at least in principle, in ordinary citizens rather than kings was world-historical. Melville feels that energy deeply. But he also knows America is hypocritical. So his democracy is not complacent. It is not “America is already just.” It is more like: > The democratic idea is sacred, and therefore every violation of it is intolerable. That is an important distinction. ## Melville’s democracy in *Moby-Dick* *Moby-Dick* is full of democratic feeling. The Pequod is a strange little floating world with men from different races, nations, religions, and classes. Ishmael repeatedly treats supposedly “primitive” or marginalized figures with more moral seriousness than many respectable Christians. Queequeg is the obvious example. He is introduced as alien, frightening, even comic, but he quickly becomes one of the noblest people in the book. Ishmael’s friendship with him is one of the most radical democratic gestures in the novel. Ishmael has to unlearn his inherited prejudices and discover dignity where his culture taught him not to see it. That is very close to the Chapter 26 passage: dignity does not wear the expected robes. ## But Melville is not naïve about democracy At the same time, Melville is deeply wary of crowds, mobs, charisma, and collective surrender. That matters because Ahab is, in one sense, an anti-democratic figure: a tyrant aboard a ship. But he does not rule only by force. He captures the crew’s imagination. That makes the Pequod politically interesting. It is full of democratic human material — ordinary workers, racial diversity, practical competence, shared danger — but it becomes vulnerable to authoritarian obsession. So Melville’s view is not simply: > Democracy good, monarchy bad. It is more complex: > Human beings possess divine equality and democratic dignity, but they can still surrender that dignity to charismatic madness, hierarchy, violence, money, fear, or metaphysical obsession. That is one reason the novel feels modern. ## Starbuck’s role The fact that this passage appears around Starbuck matters. Starbuck is not a king, not a philosopher, not a prophet. He is a working officer on a whaling ship. But Melville presents him with “august dignity.” Starbuck represents a kind of sober, moral, practical, religious conscience. He has courage, but not theatrical courage. He has dignity, but not grandeur. He is not Ahab. That contrast is crucial: * **Ahab** has tragic greatness, intensity, command, and morbid grandeur. * **Starbuck** has moral dignity, restraint, humility, and ordinary courage. Melville admires both in different ways, but he does not confuse them. Ahab is more spectacular. Starbuck may be more genuinely good. ## Why the passage feels politically relevant Your point about the left overlooking this is fair, though I’d put it slightly differently. The best democratic tradition in America has always had two tasks: 1. **Expose the betrayal** — slavery, racial caste, genocide, exploitation, exclusion. 2. **Preserve the promise** — equality, anti-aristocracy, dignity of labor, government without kings, moral worth beyond class. If you only do the first, America becomes nothing but hypocrisy. If you only do the second, America becomes mythology. Melville is powerful because he can do both. He can see the democratic promise and the human horror at the same time. ## Bottom line That passage is Melville giving a theological and poetic defense of democracy: > Human dignity does not come from rank. It comes from the divine presence in every person, including the worker, sailor, foreigner, and outcast. But because Melville is Melville, this is not a cheerful civics lesson. It is a sacred claim made in a world that constantly humiliates, ranks, exploits, and destroys people. That tension — democratic exaltation versus actual human degradation — is one of the engines of *Moby-Dick*.
(Vague not-really-spoilers for early chapters, half-joking) I didn't realize you were getting us to read yaoi for Pride.
I guess, I never actually read it.
Just started reading the book. Actually re-reading, I read it a very long time ago. I came across the following: "Why did the poor poet of Tennessee, upon suddenly receiving two handfuls of silver, deliberate whether to buy him a coat, which he sadly needed or invest the money in a pedestrian trip to Rockaway Beach?" I thought that he might be referring to Judas (the pieces of silver) because I think Melville like his Christian imagery but I did some research and that's probably not it. I don't think he's referring to the "poor poet" as any specific person but that sentence is essentially talking about the way the ocean can attract people to it. Which is part of his explanation of why Ishmael has to go to sea once in a while So he's saying even a poor poet might spend his money to go to the beach rather than on a new coat. I agree with that. I mean not the coat thing but the ocean can really be inspiring.
I think it's that everyone has weird beliefs. Ishmael's idea that everyone is drawn to the ocean is one. But we believe what we believe. The truth in it is that sometimes people go to the beach because it's handy, others want to go because it isn't handy where they live. But it's also true that some people don't especially care for the beach, or the ocean. So this is a clear early example of the "unreliable narrator" pretentious bullet point. I think what Melville's doing is more that every real person is an unreliable narrator of one sort or other. That's why we say IMO, after all. And Ishmael is defending his belief with plausible examples that he feels need an explanation. His is that the beach is popular because people are drawn to the sea. It's more of a rationalization of his own urge.
FYI for those interested, Moby Dick being in the public domain of course means that it is available for free online; including via WikiSource, a sister project of Wikipedia. The entire book has been transcribed from scans, but many of the pages are not yet validated/proofread. Side benefit: when you validate pages, it counts as making Wikipedia edits, and if you make enough edits, your account gets access to the Wikipedia Library i.e. free access to a bunch of scientific journals! https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Moby-Dick_(1851)_US_edition Follow this link, and click the "Source" button. Pages in need of validation have a Yellow status. Then enter that page, click the "Edit" button, and proofread based on the provided scan!
I will also add that Standard Ebooks (https://standardebooks.org) has great open-source versions of TONS of public domain books for free. I will be reading that edition.
Love the book club gig! Looking forward to the steam.
Can't attend Sat Aug 1 at 7:30 EDT. But this triggered so many thoughts I just have to comment... * Moby Dick lives up to its reputation. I am only an occasional reader of fiction of any kind and found the story to be gripping! The language and style do take some getting used to. * For those not inclined to read all of Moby Dick, consider the Edgar Allen Poe novel "Narrative of Arthur Gordon Pym of Nantucket". This pre-dates Moby Dick, but is in the same spirit, and is a bit more accessible (i.e. shorter). * Another musical connection: In the 1970s the band Mountain released a song titled "Nantucket Sleighride (To Owen Coffin)". It was only today that I finally learned online about Owen Coffin. He was a sailor who met his demise on an expedition aboard the whaling ship Essex, and possibly one of Melville's many influences. ///
I flunked English Lit 101, because I said Moby Dick was a fish story, and not a treatise on Christianity as my Prof demanded. Decades later I read about the Essex - it was a FISH story.
I'm a big fan of the Gregory Peck movie but never got to read the book I'll go find a good copy in my language. Thanks for this initiative!
"He beckons. He beckons."
When I saw the selection for the second book club, I got very hesitant - too many interesting, nice, international books. The it suddenly crossed my mind: let's catch the big fish!
I bought it and my god, it's the thickest book I've ever attempted. Looking forward to digging in. I think this is going to be an engaging book club for sure.
Moby Dick is in my top 8 favorite books
Funny how the Philly PD code for a dead body became a kid's meme. And now I have a pavlovian reaction to another 2 digit number starting with 6. Now I have to find a copy of Moby Dick. Call me, Ishmael.
Yes! I never got around to reading this, but I only heard good things so I will probably like it. The meet-up time is a little tricky for me in Europe BUT it's the weekend (and I'm a night owl) so I should be there.
Same for me, it's 2:30 AM my time. But it's a good reason for me to attempt reading this book.
I didn't know you had a child. My favorite geeky physicist is a mother! That's one child who will learn what the scientific method is!
I'm not sure I can finish the audio book before it's due. 2-week checkout. Probably will be able to renew it. Whatevers. While I'd like nothing more than to be a pal of Angela's, even an indirect reference to child care playing a role in your day-to-day feels like coloring outside the lines. In the context of stuff you've tried not to disclose.
Which metal adaptation is your favorite?
"I love this idea so much. I love bookclub." I'm enjoying it, too! Thank you for running it. I'm reading the Norton Critical 3rd ed., which I saw recommended by others online. It has abundant footnotes, which I'm finding helpful. "So many metal bands have based concept albums on it for a reason" Surprised to see you mention this just because the times you've mentioned music have been pretty limited in palette. I'm guessing you know this more due to a love for the book rather than enjoying Mastodon lmao. To everyone: Go listen to Leviathan!
WHITE WHALE! HOLY GRAIL!
You should read Ascendence of a Bookworm. A book about a girl making books. 😂