Recorded Live Video: acollierastro goes live

Very late to the party but I just finished the book and watched this. Re: Genly's misogyny, I had a different and maybe more depressing take, which is that maybe this was just what UKL thought of as standard male attitudes circa 1969, and she was deliberately making the point that thousands of years in the future... dudes would still be like that. I don't remember any indication in the text that he's markedly different from other men of his era (which could be an answer to "why didn't they send a non-misogynist?"—maybe they're all still like that). BTW I really recommend the Earthsea books, which are WAY better worldbuilding and storytelling than the Hainish ones IMO.

Joined the Patreon late so I missed this live but wanted to share anyway. I read this book in my college sci-fi class in the late '80s, so it was in an era where it was much easier to not know some of the topics this discusses, but also I was a much different reader. So back then, I thought it was a really good book, that it touched on a lot of interesting concepts, and that the story was fascinating. I'm sure we discussed it in class but I don't remember any of that. Having watched the recording of this, I think I have a much better perspective! I didn't know that she didn't have an editor, but in retrospect that does explain quite a bit. I feel like some part of this story was "let me tell you this story from the perspective of a character with some serious flaws", and that's really hard to pull off when there isn't also another character in the book who calls it out. Otherwise it can read as "here's what the future will be like, unlikable guys making bad decisions that no one can correct" and that's not nearly as interesting of a story, you can get that stuff just by reading the news. I do really like LeGuin, but I also think that these books are a product of their era and that you don't have to give them grace for that, similar to how I look at Heinlein differently from knowing more about him (although tbh some of that should have been obvious - "libertarians in space" is a completely unworkable concept and I didn't see that when I was younger). This can be both a really good book and also a book that didn't age well.

Super late to this but just finished the book and agreed with a lot of what you said especially how the whole gender aspect despite seeming so important not really being a huge factor in the world building and plot. I'll admit, I wasn't super critical of Genly as a character. I thought he was supposed to be kind of a stand-in for your average 60s guy. Even though I wasn't able to participate in the live stream (I work evenings) I'd love for you to do it again, I'm always itching to find someone talking about books after I've read them.

Your a great storyteller. Would love to see a book when you’re ready!

missed the livestream by like an hour but overall really liked it!! I think opinions interlaced thru would be really good for future ones. As a nb human I really like the world of Gethen. I find it interesting that the Ekumen would name the planet Winter. It's very colonialism-chic of them to see the literal most surface level thing about the world and brand it as such. Also, given all of the different folktales/other stories in the book being related to how divided/isolated the people of Gethen are because of the climate, I saw the malleability of sex on the planet as a way to survive even when you didn't have as many neighbors. Dark/Cold/Far & Light/Warm/Near felt more like the salient concepts as the fertile window for the Gethens made them seek each other out.

Also, I loved the way you navigated your first / kinda first livestream. I liked to be able to follow how you formulate thoughts, discard thoughts, etc. And it will be changing. Like many others, I am here because I love your storytelling. And I have no doubt that you will also make something unique to you out of this specific kind of medium and communication.

I haven't read the book but I really appreciate that this live has introduced me to this book and this author. When you were contemplating if maybe she took on too many huge topics all at the same time and also within the same "this planet is like this" one concept, I thought ... yes, that sounds reasonable, that she took on women's rights as well as agender, non-binary, asexual etc. in one book, that's maybe more than either she could do fully justice to, and also more than many readers 60 years ago might have managed to work with at the same time. BUT It would still be a lot today. Most men still struggle heavily with just listening and opening their eyes to how women experience the world, even in liberal western societies. Let alone anything else.

Just for the record, I know you know this, but: Human civilization on Earth has actually evolved and grown and left the archaic and incorrigible death penalty in the past. Not ALL of Earth, and not ALL societies on Earth, but does that matter, if someone were to talk about us as a whole planet? I would hate it if someone from outer space visited Earth and then went back to their origin and said "Humans are primitive and cruel, they still have the death penalty." I would really feel wronged and think, F U, just because the US does that, doesn't mean humans aren't better than this in other parts of the world. Humans also don't let other humans die from diabetes just because they can't pay for extortion prices on medication. The US does, but ... see above. But that's a thing that also annoys me in Star Trek, for example. LeGuin at least includes the concept of different political and societal ideologies on the same planet.

Sorry I missed it - will try to make it next time!

Note: RLV chat omits the emoji clicks. I'm sure Angela & live attendees will have noticed this, but for the record. These emojis were like thumbs-up, heart, 100%, and a few more. Hover for a list of by whom. Beside the emojis, total count, as I recall. These were displayed realtime. There was continuous realtime talking by our host & chat comments by us, so the comments & the emojis went by at a furious pace. But it was possible to scroll back in the chat & see them. In the RLV, too, we can scroll the chat back & see the earlier comments (but no going forward ahead of the current video's play position). Sans the emoji stuff. It was interesting to see who had been reading which comments, & who was mostly listening & responding to our host's reactions. The side comments between the attendees were ongoing & quite interesting.

This was awesome. I would love to have this done again, definitely definitely with a poll. I don’t think you were in the wrong interest LHOD, even if it is annoying in many places. Can’t wait for the next one!

I cannot say how highly i recommend The Dispossessed it’s so good and I think you’d be really interested in it. It feels a lot like this one but is a little bit clearer in its messaging I think

I really enjoyed this. When can we do it again, and are you taking book recommendations?

I ended up having to miss the livestream but it was still fun watching the recording! Yes, do more book clubs.

It was very organized, very structured and very smooth. I liked it a lot.

I couldn’t come due to a zoom conflict :(, but I am so glad I did, I really appreciated the community’s thoughts—I also agree that the gender phenomenon wasn’t as truly developed in the parochial relationships and small scale politics—that didn’t have war but did have political prisoners, which could have been explored more. Also yes please more books clubs when you can.

This was awesome! I’d love to do it again! :D

After the chat, I wonder how many people watched The Revenant & loved it but didn't know the word & never looked it up. I mean, it's a no-brainer that I need to know that word. Bc growing up I was a kid reading books from the adults section & looking up words was par for the course. P.S. And, I need to know how to say the word if I want to ever say it. I mean, the litmus test is can I think of two possible ways. If so, I have to pay attention to that while I'm looking up the meaning. As an example, angina is an example where there was a right way to pronounce it, but now there are 2 ways in some dictionaries thanks to people never having heard it in speech & not bothering to look it up. Drift is natural, but it didn't happen as much or as fast when commoners were illiterate, as happens modernly when so many illiterates can read & write. :) P.P.S. I missed the beginning of the chat, but now I'm enjoying the replay. I have to take a break from that to go visit Mom & have some dinner, but you won't miss me. Somehow I started calling it a chat mostly for the brevity, but it still doesn't show up under Chats. I like Dead Stream better than Recorded Live Video, but I'll go with that. RLV. Even though the chat transcript also shows up. They're synchronized, that is the chat sort of scrolls by like any old live chat while the recorded live is playing. Basically the transcript is simulated, ie, also like recorded video. See, quibbling, ie, nitpicking details can be relevant. According to me. Relevant, did I just say? I meant Revenant.

I need to re-read the left hand of darkness. Before I watch the section, i havent read it since I was a kid so

Also, I had gone back to comment this on the TLHOD post, but now that this post exists, it makes more sense to put it here. Copy-pasting: Don't know how many people will come back to this post and see this, but the essay "Is Gender Necessary?" by Le Guin was mentioned during the livestream, so I thought I'd link it here. Options in the block at the top of the page for however you prefer to read the text. This version contains her own later-added commentary in brackets, so you can read the original essay as well as her later reflections on it: https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/ursula-k-le-guin-is-gender-necessary-redux

Oh no i missed it due to pain wahh. I wanted to ask if you saw quantum gaming thumbsticks

Absolutely, and I'd be interested in doing it more frequently than that if you ever find the bandwidth

Yes sounds great 👍

Oh my you’re live!

oh my and the chat appears. great!